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View Diary: 15 y.o Obama Inaugural Performer Gunned Down (309 comments)

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  •  This is why those who feel banning guns (6+ / 0-)

    is 'the best and only answer' are simply wrong: because you will not ban them all in this country.

    Those who will NOT follow the rules will be the problem even after all the other responsible people have been needlessly infringed upon.

    You have to understand this: taking  guns away from rule-followers wont stop people from using guns. Some people will NOT follow the rules.

    We have to find other mechanisms that do work.

    The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men.

    by xxdr zombiexx on Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 09:23:27 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  so when a nutball decides (12+ / 0-)

      to gun down people in a grocery store, we should install metal detectors at the door? Then we'll be safe?

      So far, we're being frisked at airports and locked down and buzzed in at schools. Does the rest of the public square need to resemble a booking room at the police station before we have a real discussion of 'protecting our freedoms' and what that does and does not include?

      It's not like we can buy nukes at WalMart. Why make military-grade weapons freely available? It's not either or in my opinion.

      We can't have an honest discussion about gun violence in this country when you take things 'off the table' and pretend it's a constitutional right. Yes, I said pretend. I will stop using that word when our protection from illegal search and seizure is given the same level of reverence.

      Stay-at-home-Moms: Hard working unless they're on welfare, then they're lazy. Just ask any Republican.

      by musicsleuth on Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 09:59:23 AM PST

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      •  Increased effective security (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        musicsleuth, drmah

        And NRA gun training for Missouri first graders

        State Sen. Dan Brown on Tuesday told the Senate General Laws Committee that his bill bringing the NRA’s Eddie Eagle Gunsafe Program to every elementary school was an effort to teach children how to react if they encounter an unsecured firearm. Brown had first introduced the bill one day before 20 students were gunned down at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut.

        Some Missouri schools already use the NRA program, but Brown aims to make it a universal requirement.

        “I hate mandates as much as anyone, but some concerns and conditions rise to the level of needing a mandate,” he explained to the committee.

        Banning guns - no good - arming everybody - no good.

        The solution to gun problems can;t possibly be guns.

        The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men.

        by xxdr zombiexx on Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 10:10:35 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  re-read that (2+ / 0-)

        I didn't mean 'you' personally -- more a general comment.

        Stay-at-home-Moms: Hard working unless they're on welfare, then they're lazy. Just ask any Republican.

        by musicsleuth on Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 10:14:22 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Hmmm.... you re-read me (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          musicsleuth

          I was - or so I thought - responding in a way supporting hat you had to say..... I agree.  Yer dead on.

          All the security stuff we have to deal with but please, have all the guns you want: it's something of a disconnect.

          Let's blame the vagueness of text.

          The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men.

          by xxdr zombiexx on Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 10:20:54 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  The only people gaining more freedom are gum (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        crankypatriot, musicsleuth, mrkvica

        firing manics, and the NRA wants to push this.   The rest of us lose more rights everytime thiere is another mass shooting.

        •  I do hate those "gum" firing maniacs (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          drmah, marsanges, wu ming

          That popping and smacking of gum is enough to send anyone over the edge.

          It's a hot issue at our house.  One smack of the gum, and we're off.

          "Get rid of that gum!!!"

          "Mom, you said she can't have gum in the car"

          "I'm not chewing it.  It's under my tongue."

          "She'll be back to chewing it as soon as we pull out of the driveway"

          "I didn't do anything wrong.  I am NOT smacking gum."

          "Make her get rid of it."

    •  This is the stupidest argument ever (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      anastasia p, JVolvo, mungley

      No shit, laws only "infringe" upon those who obey them. By definition, people who don't obey laws are law-breakers.

      Establishing a framework of laws and standards is still critical for the purposes of enforcement and defining the parameters of socially-acceptable behavior.

      My other car is a pair of boots.

      by FutureNow on Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 10:23:12 AM PST

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    •  That's...a really bad argument (6+ / 0-)

      If only the criminals will break the laws, why have laws in the first place?

      Time is of no account with great thoughts, which are as fresh to-day as when they first passed through their authors' minds ages ago. - Samuel Smiles

      by moviemeister76 on Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 10:48:10 AM PST

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      •  How many laws do we need? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        methylin

        If we have laws against shooting people, why do we need more laws to keep people from shooting people.  

        It's already against the law.  Of course we need laws, but how many laws do we need?

        At some point, you have to engage with people, and work on the root causes, the poverty, drug addiction, mental health, child neglect and abuse, and the civil and ethical education of children.

        Passing more laws is just pissing in the wind.    We get it already!   It's illegal to shoot people.  

        So, why does it keep happening?!

        •  Well (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          mrkvica, schnecke21, mungley

          Rape is illegal in this country. And yet a California court just ruled that a particular case was not technically rape due to an archaic law. So, Californians now have to write a new law to fix that. That's what you do as your society evolves. A problem comes up, you realize the system you have does not adequately address it and you adjust.

          And perhaps if we could legally enforce the laws we had you would have a better argument. But since gun rights advocates made sure that we can't, your argument is quite weak.

          Time is of no account with great thoughts, which are as fresh to-day as when they first passed through their authors' minds ages ago. - Samuel Smiles

          by moviemeister76 on Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 01:18:57 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  It is no longer illegal to shoot people in Florida (0+ / 0-)

          As a matter of fact it is not illegal to shoot people in most states.
          Shooting in self-defense in certain situations is perfectly legal in most of the country.

          Sure

          At some point, you have to engage with people, and work on the root causes, the poverty, drug addiction, mental health, child neglect and abuse, and the civil and ethical education of children.
          Let's fund those things.

          Where modifying the law comes into play is drawing the lines more clearly between legal action and illegal action.

          If we need a specific law that says, "No person who has made a credible threat against another person's life shall be issued a permit to carry a gun, then we should pass that law."

          If we need a law that says, "Negligent handling of a firearm is cause for criminal prosecution." Then we should pass that law.

          Laws are the tools we use to preserve the social contract.

          Take back the House in 2014!!!! ( 50-state strategy needed)

          by mungley on Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 05:05:18 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

    •  "Rule followers" A surprising number of people (0+ / 0-)

      'follow the rules' until they stop following the rules and murder people.

      The guy in Phoenix this morning followed the rules for 70 years.

      I realize that you said, "Gun ban can't be the the best and only answer," but bans on many types of weapons and severe restrictions are a start.

      Take back the House in 2014!!!! ( 50-state strategy needed)

      by mungley on Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 04:53:05 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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