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View Diary: Richard III’s Body Found? (310 comments)

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  •  Yes Margaret Beaufort (4+ / 0-)

    was critical in the whole thing. What I find interesting in the history of these civil wars is how many strong women were involved despite the fact that it was not a typical role for women. Eleanor of Aquitaine, Margaret of Anjou and Margaret Beaufort were amazing women.

    The men were ruthless and of course Warwick kept switching sides in an attempt to be the Kingmaker. The times were barbaric and unless you had a really strong king like Henry Vth, there was guaranteed to be trouble. Edward IV really set up the whole thing by marrying Elizabeth Woodville over Warwick's objections. Once Edward died all hell broke loose.

    In our sleep, pain which cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart until, in our own despair, comes wisdom through the awful grace of God ~RFK

    by vcmvo2 on Sun Feb 03, 2013 at 09:58:27 PM PST

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    •  and the marriage to elizabeth (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      citylights, radarlady, vcmvo2, Dvalkure

      already was creating problems during edward's lifetime, because his inner circle began to doubt him, and the way he favored her family, and married her female relatives to all the kingdom's most prominent men, alienated warwick, who wanted a couple of those men for his daughters.

      but henry v himself had a complex legacy, still trying to justify his father's completely unjustified usurpation, while hypocritically trying to conquer france for a claim through a female ancestor (edward ii's wife, isabella, last surviving capetian heir) while denying a similar claim to the mortimers in england through clarence, the latter getting him killed before his son was even born...

      the bottom line is that this ruling monarchy stuff just doesn't work...

      The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

      by Laurence Lewis on Sun Feb 03, 2013 at 10:31:37 PM PST

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      •  Yep! (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Laurence Lewis, Dvalkure

        A ruling monarchy, no matter how attractive the myths surrounding their reign is just not responsive to their subjects needs.

        They are brought up not to govern but to fight wars and take territory for the greater glory of their treasury and God!

        In our sleep, pain which cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart until, in our own despair, comes wisdom through the awful grace of God ~RFK

        by vcmvo2 on Mon Feb 04, 2013 at 07:07:07 AM PST

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        •  And this differs from today's Repub. Party in (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          vcmvo2

          what respect ???!! Okay, not allowed to stab your opponent with a sword 'til he dies.

           Major Political figures of both parties, of course, but I feel the R's are worse and more blatant offenders. Ambition and ruthlessness never seem to go out of fashion.

           Although, we Hippies did try !

          “Good things don’t come to those who wait. They come to those who agitate!” Julian Bond

          by Dvalkure on Mon Feb 04, 2013 at 11:24:12 AM PST

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    •  and btw... (6+ / 0-)

      i recently bought, but haven't read, nancy goldstone's four queens. and i plan to do a photo diary or two on eleanor of aquitaine, when i have the time. i've been to most of her main haunts, from poitiers to bordeaux to paris to winchester and old sarum to chinon to fontevrault.

      The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

      by Laurence Lewis on Sun Feb 03, 2013 at 10:36:45 PM PST

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