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View Diary: Bigelow's Tortured Excuses (22 comments)

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  •  Thanks... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Meteor Blades

    ...I just read it and agree it is interesting and informative.

    But why should it matter if torture does or doesn't work? Why should it matter if torture is depicted as working or not, or if the victim or torturer is depicted as sympathetic or enemy? And why on earth should a film which can arguably be construed as presenting a CIA perspective be considered as potential influence on prosecutions?

    The case against torture is moral and tactical and those other considerations are not, or at least should not, be pertinent.

    IMO being opposed to torture has to be firm and consistent regardless of how despicable or non cooperative the victims may be, despite if it works or not, and despite the good or evil of the torturers. It's not  transaction.

    Also the power being imbued upon a movie, albeit maybe artistic but without doubt ultimately a commercial endeavor, seems unwise and irrational.  

    •  I agree with your 2nd and 3rd paragraphs... (3+ / 0-)
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      kck, burlydee, 714day

      ...but disagree with your 4th. Perhaps movies should not have the power embued them, but they do, and they have all the way back to at least 1915 when Birth of a Nation helped revive the Ku Klux Klan. Movies help move the cultural and political attitudes of the nation (sometimes the world). They are powerful influences and we just have to accept that reality. If they they weren't, we wouldn't talk so much about them.

      Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

      by Meteor Blades on Wed Feb 06, 2013 at 11:31:54 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Why don't you ask the commander of West Point (0+ / 0-)

      about the power of even a purely fictional show like 24 on the torture "debate"?  You know, the one that got Kiefer Sutherland himself to come down and try to convince the cadets that torture is ineffective.  If Bigelow is invited by the commander of West Point to do the same will she do so or will she refuse because it would compromise her "neutral position"?

      You have watched Faux News, now lose 2d10 SAN.

      by Throw The Bums Out on Wed Feb 06, 2013 at 01:00:07 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  The 'torture debate'... (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Throw The Bums Out

        ...should be independent of if it works and certainly irrespective of the sage advice of a TV actor or a film director.

        Maybe West Point would be better served by using icons of philosophy, religion, wars, or history to help dissuade cadets from engaging in illegal behavior but TV/film? What a way to debase the whole issue IMHO.

        I get what you're saying but TV and film and any medium used for commercial purposes use exploitation, drama, sex, drugs, violence, greed, lust, etc. to gain audience.

        MB's example of Birth of a Nation having helped revive the Ku Klux Klan is a great example of my error. I can think of a few others. But generally I suspect (no expert here) they're more rare exceptions and am more inclined these days to beg the which-came-first-chicken-or-egg debate when it comes to film and culture. My vote is that film at best reflects our culture and drives little but exploits already deeply held drives.

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