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View Diary: BREAKING:"Burn that f**ker down," say cops. (370 comments)

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  •  lots of guns (3+ / 0-)

    no bombs. his guns were useless against armored vehicles. it's not he that is the victim, it's the concept of due process.

    The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

    by Laurence Lewis on Tue Feb 12, 2013 at 11:33:36 PM PST

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    •  r.p.g. n/t (0+ / 0-)

      EdriesShop Is it kind? is it true? is it necessary?

      by edrie on Tue Feb 12, 2013 at 11:59:18 PM PST

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    •  They have to paint out viewpoint (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kyril

      as sympathetic to violence because that is the only ammunition they have against his damning manifesto.

      Too bad there are thousands of us law enforcement screwed out of jobs the same way.

      Let them glorify violence and uprate each other. I'm not stopping until I do everything I can to make sure we live in a civil society.

      "Til you're so fucking crazy you can't follow their rules" John Lennon - Working Class Hero

      by Horace Boothroyd III on Wed Feb 13, 2013 at 04:58:39 AM PST

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      •  There's nothing uncivil about the legal use (0+ / 0-)

        of deadly force, and this is consistent across every legal system on the planet.  That's why I jumped in this conversation in the first place: people using the term "due process" as if "use of deadly force" isn't a universally understood concept for apprehending suspects who are shooting at you.  There is no civil society on the planet where law enforcement is expected to be passive targets for an armed suspect.

        What it seems like your'e suggesting - and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong - is that it was immaterial how many officers he killed and may have continued to kill, as long as they captured him alive, because they had some duty to.   If that's not what you're saying, please amend.

        There's nothing about my comments - or anyone else in this thread - that's "glorifying violence".  I'm one person removed from two of Dorner's victims, one of those a civilian.  I've had as much violence as I can take in this case.  And while I'm happy certain FPers are suddenly experts in police tactics they know little about, I suspect that few of us would be making these decisions if we had the responsibility for other lives on our backs.

        Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

        by pico on Wed Feb 13, 2013 at 09:49:15 AM PST

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        •  Use of force for the police have rules for (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          pico

          escalation.

          I have been trained in these rules. Our current police forces are apparently not aware of them. Thus my efforts to effect change.

          "Til you're so fucking crazy you can't follow their rules" John Lennon - Working Class Hero

          by Horace Boothroyd III on Wed Feb 13, 2013 at 09:55:40 AM PST

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          •  This is true, but the case in question (0+ / 0-)

            is far more clear-cut than, say, the same police department's shooting of an unarmed student in January which is (rightly) the subject of an ongoing probe.   Dorner killed one officer and wounded another, and, barring a clear change in circumstances, that's automatic coverage under deadly force law.

            Unfortunately due to the media shutout, I'm not sure we'll get a clear picture of the progression of events after the helicopters were sent away.   I don't know if their specific escalation or activities were by-the-book or straight-up illegal, and I can't say I'll read the eventual report without a few heavy grains of salt.  What I'm arguing here, and in this thread, is that use of deadly force is a completely plausible and defensible legal category for what we do know was going down at the time.  

            Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

            by pico on Wed Feb 13, 2013 at 10:10:12 AM PST

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