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View Diary: Open thread for Night Owls: 4,000 show up Sunday for Keystone XL pipeline protest in San Francisco (109 comments)

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  •  Just saying this is lost isn't (2+ / 0-)
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    Burned, citisven

    clarifying.  It's repeating yourself.  This fight isn't over and pretending like it is doesn't make it so.  These rallies are one aspect of the protests, there are direct actions taking place that will be stepped up.  You seem to be counseling that we give up because it will be hard.

    And again, note that "you're going to fail" is no sort of constructive criticism.  Not a single person who I've heard saying it has pointed out a better path for action, not one.

    •  There is a difference between (0+ / 0-)

      fighting a competitive battle and a non competitive.  My exact point is the fighting is not all together over. which is a bad tactical move. "You are going to fail" is constructive criticism when I am recommending that the movement all together point its effort elsewhere which will it will have a positive effect.

      Its called prioritization. This battle should not be prioritized at this point because of the very high likelihood of failure.

      Want a specific point which needs more attention?

      Regulation of fracking.  

      Note NOT banning fracking but regulation. Banning fracking will be another loosing battle. Properly regulating is a winnable and valuable battle.

      The problem with the EV movemnt is not its goal but its ineptatude for choosing battles. The movement often fights un-winnable battles while skipping places where good progress can be made.

      The difference is PR vs actualy getting shit done.

      Picking battles that make the news vs picking battles that make a difference is very counterproductive.

      •  You seem to think that stopping extraction (0+ / 0-)

        of carbon will always be a losing battle.  If that's the case then there's no reason to bother even trying.  If your goal is to stop climate change then that carbon needs to stay in the ground.  Regulating fracking doesn't make that happen, and if we can't make that happen then we're in serious trouble.

        •  In your vision its acompletely unwinnable battle (0+ / 0-)

          Can you stop it all together? No. Thats a joke. What you can do minimize the damage from it.

          Banning fracking is not going to happen. Banning oil pipelines for generic any carbon reasons will not work either. Getting a pipeline moved because of the excess danger a particular route causes. Will work. Has worked and will work again.  Cap and trade or carbon fees are a possibility, a stretch and a semi realistic dream.

          Yes avoidable damage will happen. It sucks but its reality.

          Which is worse an oil company who polluted a valuable drinking supply

          Or the EV organization who could have realistically protected the supply if they were not too busy posing for some press shots at a guaranteed to fail rally?

          Resources are not infinite you must spend them where they matter.

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