Skip to main content

View Diary: Do we really need 10 obsolete aircraft carriers? (159 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  We need carriers (7+ / 0-)

    because of our treaty obligations to Taiwan, the Philippines, Japan and Israel. In case of attacks on any of these allies Carrier tasks groups represent our only credible means to project defensive capabilities to these locations. Were we to need to hurry troops to a given location using our gator Navy the carrier groups' fighter umbrella would be essential in their defense.

    You can argue that we should not be allied with these countries, but until our obligations are abrogated carriers represent our only means of fulfilling them short of offensive nuclear weapons attack.

    "Fascism is attracting the dregs of humanity- people with a slovenly biography - sadists, mental freaks, traitors." - ILYA EHRENBURG

    by durrati on Tue Feb 19, 2013 at 12:54:18 PM PST

    •  OK I will argue that we shold not be allied with (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Wednesday Bizzare, YucatanMan

      these countries or perhaps they would like to pay for the carriers?  Why should we pay for the carriers to defend them and not have enough funds to serve our people at home?  

      •  I'll entertain your argument (4+ / 0-)

        now go to work on the U.S. Senate.

        In the meantime look at the globe. The Americas are isolated from 3/4's of the world's population by two big blue things called oceans. Our caability to trade and defend our allies rely on our ability to ply these oceans and keep open vital choke points such as The Panama and Suez canals and the Strait of Hormuz.

        Good luck living in the 19th century, I kinda like the 21st.  

        "Fascism is attracting the dregs of humanity- people with a slovenly biography - sadists, mental freaks, traitors." - ILYA EHRENBURG

        by durrati on Tue Feb 19, 2013 at 01:58:15 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Alliances used to imply MUTUAL effort (0+ / 0-)

          Why do we have to pay to defend nations that are not doing their part?  Very few nations are indispensable to the US.  I'll give you Canada for proximity and the UK for actually making an effort to do their part.  In fact I like that the UK was the Empire in the 19th century.   If nations want to be defended by us let them pay for it.

          And I think you are living in the 20th century not the 21st.  

          •  S. Korea, Japan, Taiwan and Israel (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Senor Unoball, Quicklund, alain2112

            do their part by allying with us...they keep democracy alive in parts of the world where it is sorely lacking.

            "Fascism is attracting the dregs of humanity- people with a slovenly biography - sadists, mental freaks, traitors." - ILYA EHRENBURG

            by durrati on Tue Feb 19, 2013 at 02:15:23 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Allies defend you (0+ / 0-)

              We have a few good allies and with the exception of France they all speak the King's English - Canada, the UK, Australia are allies as is France.   They are the only countries that consistently make some effort to participate with forces on the ground when we need them.  S Korea, Taiwan, and Israel are not allies they are expensive dependents.  

              I am pretty much an isolationist.  Easy to be an isolationist in the Midwest.  I probably should have been Canadian.  I figure don't mess with others and they are a lot less likely to mess with you.  Keep acquiring "allies" that do nothing but stick out there thousands of miles from home at risk of attack and all that does for you is force the Minnesota National Guard to be shipped to the middle east or wherever to defend someone who would never defend you.

              •  Canada might as well be (3+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                skohayes, Quicklund, alain2112

                a fifty-first state they rely on us for defense as well.

                I do not believe in imposing democracy at the point of a gun as the neo-cons do but I agree that democracies rarely attack one another and the ability of nations to choose their own government is an important factor in building a real and lasting peace in the world so I appreciate all of our DEMOCRATIC allies. As for some of the others I have less appreciation...

                "Fascism is attracting the dregs of humanity- people with a slovenly biography - sadists, mental freaks, traitors." - ILYA EHRENBURG

                by durrati on Tue Feb 19, 2013 at 02:49:37 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  Canada (3+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  DeadHead, Quicklund, Senor Unoball

                  for a small country, has sent a greater percentage of their population to die in foreign wars than we have.

                  Go look up Vimy Ridge and Dieppe and then get back to me on trashing Canada.

                  If the pilot's good, see, I mean if he's reeeally sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low... oh you oughta see it sometime. It's a sight. A big plane like a '52... varrrooom! Its jet exhaust... frying chickens in the barnyard!

                  by Major Kong on Tue Feb 19, 2013 at 07:05:36 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I apologize (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Quicklund, Senor Unoball

                    I know of course, of Canada's contributions in WW I and II but was referring to their defense posture relative to ours and in no way meant to trash her.

                    "Fascism is attracting the dregs of humanity- people with a slovenly biography - sadists, mental freaks, traitors." - ILYA EHRENBURG

                    by durrati on Wed Feb 20, 2013 at 07:08:39 AM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  Understood (2+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      durrati, Quicklund

                      As an American, it's sometimes hard for us to see things from another country's point of view.

                      A Canadian might point out that they've only been attacked twice in their history - and both times the attacker was us.

                      If the pilot's good, see, I mean if he's reeeally sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low... oh you oughta see it sometime. It's a sight. A big plane like a '52... varrrooom! Its jet exhaust... frying chickens in the barnyard!

                      by Major Kong on Wed Feb 20, 2013 at 10:35:31 AM PST

                      [ Parent ]

    •  Having Israel as an ally (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      DeadHead, Whatithink

      is like having a loudmouthed little friend who's constantly picking fights with bikers and expecting you to come to his aid.

      If the pilot's good, see, I mean if he's reeeally sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low... oh you oughta see it sometime. It's a sight. A big plane like a '52... varrrooom! Its jet exhaust... frying chickens in the barnyard!

      by Major Kong on Tue Feb 19, 2013 at 07:06:54 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site