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View Diary: Updated x2 - CNBC/CNN put Tesla to the Test. NY Times Fails. (230 comments)

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  •  Hybrids are more practical for now (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    duhban, Quicklund, NYFM

    But in the future when it's the gas stations that will be "hybrid" selling dino-juice as well as electrons, a cheaper Leaf will dominate - especially as the price of gas goes ever higher.

    But we have to get from here to there.  Hybrids just make gas less needed, but still necessary - I should know, my Prius gets 50-55 mpg (rain&cold makes things a bit slower), but my 300+ mi/wk commute still means I visit the gas station every 1.5 weeks or so.

    Zero emissions is a real goal, and it's been met by cars like the Leaf, TeslaS and (for smaller ranges) the Volt.

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    by sacrelicious on Tue Feb 19, 2013 at 10:41:20 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  Zero emissions depends on the state. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Deward Hastings, K S LaVida

      If you live in a state that mines coal, chances are your electricity has a serious coal component.  The emissions take place, just at a smokestack instead of at your tailpipe.  

      "Politics should be the part-time profession of every citizen who would protect the rights and privileges of free people and who would preserve what is good and fruitful in our national heritage." -- Lucille Ball

      by Yamaneko2 on Wed Feb 20, 2013 at 01:01:27 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Right, because there are ZERO emissions in oil (7+ / 0-)

        production.  Exploring, drilling, transporting, refining, further transporting, and pumping/selling all take place without a single drop of oil burnt or a single electron fired.  Let's not even get into the tremendous amount of emissions produced by having to maintain a ginormous army and navy and air force to patrol the shipping lanes so the oil keeps flowing.

        I really am getting sick of this coal-fired electricity nonsense.  It's an oil industry talking point, and those idiots don't even realize it applies right back to them. Every gas station in the states that use coal is also burning electricity all day, every day.  

      •  Here is the deal, if we can centralize (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        otto, MPociask, SLKRR, Quicklund, sacrelicious

        our energy needs to one mode (electrical system) to the extent we can green that single mode, the entire system will be greened.  Going electric is the first step in greening.

        "I watch Fox News for my comedy, and Comedy Central for my news." - Facebook Group

        by Sychotic1 on Wed Feb 20, 2013 at 03:56:51 AM PST

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      •  A pure-EV allows me to go off-grid (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        radical simplicity

        And setup my own solar installation to power my house and car.

        You cannot do that with a gas car. At all.

        Plus, I would posit that the EROEI and pollution output of coal power+transmission+zero-emmissions is still better than the oil extraction (and the military force to force other countries to do that), refining, transport, storage and subsequent burning in a terribly inefficent small motor.

        Did you know that gas cars (aside from hybrids like the Prius) still have emissions while turned off?  It's called evaporative emission.

        If you want to run the numbers, I would bet you EVs still win.

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        by sacrelicious on Wed Feb 20, 2013 at 10:26:20 AM PST

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      •  Even using coal-fired electricity (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        splashy

        An electric car is cleaner than most of the internal combustion engine cars on the road in the US. The electric motor is much, much better at transforming power into motion (whereas an internal combustion engine turns most of the power from gasoline into heat, a portion of which is used to create motion).

        Electric vehicle CO2

        To summarize the linked article:

        If

        Your current car gets 33 mpg or better,

        AND

        You live in the worst region in the country for CO2-producing electric utilities (basically: Colorado), then an EV isn't going to be an improvement.

        In any other region of the country, an electric car is going to reduce CO2 vs an internal combustion car.

        And electric will reduce CO2 vs any car that gets below 33 mpg, even in the worst region in the entire country for dirty electric production.

        Note: the average mileage in American cars on the road today is: 21 mpg.
    •  I am considering the other half of hybrid (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      sacrelicious

      the extended range gas vehicle.  It pretty much stays electric for shorter trips.

      "I watch Fox News for my comedy, and Comedy Central for my news." - Facebook Group

      by Sychotic1 on Wed Feb 20, 2013 at 03:55:51 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

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