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View Diary: In Syria, Eastasia is now the Enemy (46 comments)

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  •  What about despots in Saudi Arabia and Bahrain? (4+ / 0-)

    Should the US promote regime change in those countries as well?

    Or are some dictators more equal than others?

    Learn about Centrist Economics, learn about Robert Rubin's Hamilton Project. www.hamiltonproject.org

    by PatriciaVa on Sun Feb 24, 2013 at 09:13:32 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  The U.S. should do what it's done in Egypt, Libya, (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ferg, doc2, DavidMS

      Syria, and Tunisia: sit back, let the locals lead their own regime-change effort, and only get involved late in the game, if and when an indigenous opposition becomes strong enough and large enough to pose an actual threat to the regime, then provide them with some backing.

      In all cases, the U.S. should continue to recognize that the locals themselves need to be in the lead, and that becoming involved too early or too large will only serve to discredit the opposition.

      Art is the handmaid of human good.

      by joe from Lowell on Sun Feb 24, 2013 at 09:21:34 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  So, should the US have assisted the homegrown.... (4+ / 0-)

        ...opposition in Bahrain, before it was violently slaughtered through assistance from Saudi troops?

        Learn about Centrist Economics, learn about Robert Rubin's Hamilton Project. www.hamiltonproject.org

        by PatriciaVa on Sun Feb 24, 2013 at 10:02:53 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  They were never large or strong enough. (0+ / 0-)

          The protests in Bahrain never grew to the point of having the broad public support that the protests in Egypt, Libya, or Tunisia had, probably because of the Shia-Sunni divide.  They never managed to swing large numbers of the Sunni populace against the government.

          As I just said in the previous comment, the U.S. can't put itself in the lead.

          Art is the handmaid of human good.

          by joe from Lowell on Sun Feb 24, 2013 at 10:09:57 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Bullshit (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            protectspice, Aunt Martha, InAntalya

            The protests in Bahrain were huge and supported by the majority Shiite community. The protests were so successful that in fear of its existence, the regime invited Saudi forces to come in and impose order when its security forces were overwhelmed. The symbol of the revolution - the pearl in the center of Pearl Square was demolished to remove the popular rallying point.

            The US has been supplying the Bahraini govt with weapons and is doing so because it doesn't want to pull out of Bahrain or the region. You are seriously misinformed about what has happened and is continuing to happen in Bahrain.

            •  You're very impressed w/ yourself, aren't you? (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              doc2

              Your celebration of your superiority aside, you haven't told me a single thing I didn't already know about Bahrain, and have demonstrated to my satisfaction that you know about a tenth of what you assume you know.  You actually think that the Pearl Square monument or the Saudi assistance are some esoteric knowledge?

              For instance, you don't seem to understand the difference between a strong protest movement and a weak one, like the one in Bahrain.  The actual numbers of protesters, and their ability to attract support from elements across the political spectrum and within the government itself, were never comparable to similar movements elsewhere.

              Pearl Square, derp derp, wut's that lol?  Wait, we have a base there?!?  You don't say!

              Art is the handmaid of human good.

              by joe from Lowell on Sun Feb 24, 2013 at 02:28:11 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

        •  I remember when "But what about Syria?" (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          doc2

          was the big argument for trashing the American policy towards Arab Spring.  "If the United States really supported humanitarian intervention and democratic uprisings, they'd be doing something in Syria!" went the refrain.

          And now, almost two years later, the charge has completely flip-flopped, with the proof of American perfidy being our activist policy towards Syria, as opposed to our hands-off policy.

          The only problem is, American policy towards the Syrian uprisings hasn't changed in any meaningful way while that argument flip-flopped.  We are doing exactly the same things, while being accused of meddling, that we were doing when the same people were citing our alleged non-action.

          Art is the handmaid of human good.

          by joe from Lowell on Sun Feb 24, 2013 at 10:14:54 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

    •  We do what we can. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ferg

      You've made the same comment before. As if consistency itself is the only policy guidance that matters.

      •  What bothers me is that so many Kossacks... (4+ / 0-)

        ..who criticized Bush for regime change in Iraq are now applauding President Obama for doing the same in other countries.

        Learn about Centrist Economics, learn about Robert Rubin's Hamilton Project. www.hamiltonproject.org

        by PatriciaVa on Sun Feb 24, 2013 at 10:04:46 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Maybe it is because "so many (0+ / 0-)

          Kossacks" are aware of the many differences that exist between each and every situation. Believing that regime change is always wrong is no better than those in the Bush administration who believed that regime change is always right. The world is full of subtleties, and most people here are very well aware of that. Some not so much.

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