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View Diary: Pitching Obamacare to the uninsured (43 comments)

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  •  I should pay attention (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    TJ, Rogneid, el dorado gal

    because I am one of the uninsured.

    I'm still seeking elucidation as to how it will be "affordable" for me.

    •  asdf (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Sunspots
      I'm still seeking elucidation as to how it will be "affordable" for me.
      It simply is affordable, a non-empirical fact, declared and decreed by bourgeoise supply siders who have never missed a meal or known anybody who has. They define "affordable" different from the way that the "economically disadvantaged" do. There is no "how" involved, because that is an empirical issue.

      That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

      by enhydra lutris on Wed Mar 06, 2013 at 09:23:18 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  are you serious or just anti health care (0+ / 0-)

      I was just above poverty last year and I know how to use a calculator.

      If your serious you can just go to the Kaiser web site and figure it out based on income.

      If you are just posting a "sux" comment be more obvious so I don't waste my time.

      How big is your personal carbon footprint?

      by ban nock on Wed Mar 06, 2013 at 09:57:57 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I took a look at that site (3+ / 0-)

        For my state, NY, the numbers are going to be really hard for a lot of people.

        "Liberty without virtue would be no blessing to us" - Benjamin Rush, 1777

        by kovie on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 07:36:10 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Do you have a link to that calculator? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ArchTeryx

        All I could find was a generic one that wasn't state-specific.

        "Liberty without virtue would be no blessing to us" - Benjamin Rush, 1777

        by kovie on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 07:51:40 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I used this one (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          kovie, Bush Bites

          http://healthreform.kff.org/...

          Which has 3 types of cost factors I entered high.

          Income 40K, 4 person family, to get what would normally be a 25K policy, something we've never had, we'd have to pay maximum 2K premium per year. We now pay 5k with 10K deductible for me, and for my wife who is younger it's a 4K deductible but she gets to see a doctor for a 30$ copay. So at least she can see a doctor now.

          Max per year in addition to premium is 4K. Which isn't bad at all. We get to keep the house we've been paying off and the insurance will probably be a lot better.

          I have one muscle that separated from the bone in my shoulder, they can maybe re attach and I can get back more use of my arm. Torn tendon in heel I don't think they can do much for. Discs kind of pushed together in back, not much to be done. I need to get another 20 years  out of this body. Physical work, small kids to support.

          How big is your personal carbon footprint?

          by ban nock on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 08:14:32 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  That's the one I used (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            mbradshawlong

            Living in NY my costs are going to be disproportionately higher unless I'm poor and qualify for aid. To ballpark it I gave it 50k (which in NYC isn't that much anymore), single, 50 and High, and got $8300 a year in premiums, no aid. That's really high for someone making only 50k. A lot of people are going to have to cut corners they shouldn't have to, and many will just end up going without insurance and eating the fine which gets them nothing.

            I'm not going to get into whether Obama could have gotten a better deal, but this is clearly far from where we need to be. The ACA makes things better for people at or near the poverty level, but for the lower and even middle middle class, it's simply not enough. We need single payer ASAP, and we need to cut out these middlemen who are sucking us dry.

            "Liberty without virtue would be no blessing to us" - Benjamin Rush, 1777

            by kovie on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 08:22:01 PM PST

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            •  Are there really people making over 50K (0+ / 0-)

              whose employers won't have to offer insurance under the bill? Maybe in NYC there are a few jobs you can make that in under 30 hours or with a consultant job, but not many. I understand that professionals who can't find FT or steady work are consulting now and consultants are starting to band together to form groups that can access more affordable health insurance. They may be in a slightly tough position but way less tough than not having the insurance and needing it later.

              The vast majority of people they need to educate will probably get subsidies. Most people making 50K have an employer option I'd assume - and yes, the law is not as good for people at that level as it is for the poor (and it won't really touch the rich, except those who have to provide healthcare).

              •  People who are self employed or who are contract (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                mbradshawlong

                labor but are a skilled tradesman make around that.  Tons of positions in construction that offer no insurance but pay a decent hourly salary. Truck drivers make around that but generally have no insurance.

                I have worked with a lot of teachers who choose not to take insurance, as it can cost a fortune and they make so little in some districts.

                I'm sure there are plenty of employers who are going to do everything they can think of to get out of providing insurance, if they have never done so in the past.

                •  Then labor laws are enforced poorly. (0+ / 0-)

                  Calling positions like construction "contractor" jobs (not the actual owner of the contracting company, who is a contractor to the client, but the individual workers) should be - and is technically - illegal in most places since contracted workers should have a choice of when to work, where to work, and what equipment to use. I agree it's a problem, but those people were never meant to be contractors and that's a problem better solved by fixing labor laws because it also impacts taxes and insurance and is essentially a corporate (and small business) cheat.

          •  Do you try yoga? (0+ / 0-)

            Not being a smart ass.

            A couple of my discs are crushed together and it's done wonders for me.

            "Michael Moore, who was filming a movie about corporate welfare called 'Capitalism: A Love Story,' sought and received incentives."

            by Bush Bites on Fri Mar 08, 2013 at 04:39:47 AM PST

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      •  alas, when I was just above poverty level I looked (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        mbradshawlong

        at that very same website, found out what subsidy I would get, then went to a few sites to check prices for insurance.

        The only policies I could find that the subsidy would cover were high-deductible shit policies, $2000 or so, that guaranteed I would never be able to see a doctor anyway because I could never afford the deductible.

        Has anything changed since then? I certainly don't recall hearing anything about health insurance premiums going down lately . . . . . .

        •  learn to use the calculator (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          True North, berrieh, Bush Bites

          if you are just above poverty (133%) everything is free.

          You pay nothing.

          Medicaid.

          My kids are on it now. It's like winning the lottery.

          How big is your personal carbon footprint?

          by ban nock on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 08:16:42 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  thanks for the snark, but I was not 133% above (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            asterkitty

            poverty level, so nothing was free for me. No Medicaid. As noted, the only policies I could buy with the subsidy I would get were shit $2,000-deductible policies which guaranteed I could never see a doctor anyway because I couldn't afford the deductible.

            Has that changed since then?  Or would I still be using my subsidy for a useless plan under which I still couldn't afford to get sick--just a welfare payment to the insurance companies.

            •  Or you live in a state like me... (0+ / 0-)

              such as Pennsylvania, where the asswipe governor refuses the Medicaid expansion.

              curious portal - to a world of paintings, lyric-poems, art writing, and graphic and web design

              by asterkitty on Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 09:04:26 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

            •  Then we define "Just above" differently. (0+ / 0-)

              133% is a wide margin for "just above" in my book. I do agree that we define poverty a bit poorly in this country, without taking regional factors in, sure, but that's not what you said. The idea of the subsidy for people higher up isn't that it will cover everything; there is an expectation people will put SOME of their money in for healthcare to work with the subsidy.

            •  The exchanges aren't even up yet. (0+ / 0-)

              And I know for a fact that one of the plans will be a national, non-profit plan.

              You may have more options than you think.

              "Michael Moore, who was filming a movie about corporate welfare called 'Capitalism: A Love Story,' sought and received incentives."

              by Bush Bites on Fri Mar 08, 2013 at 04:43:21 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  Where can (0+ / 0-)

                we find out more about the national non-profit plan?

              •  that still remains to be seen, then (0+ / 0-)

                Vaporware is pretty hard to sell.

                Will this national, non-profit plan, be anything decent that allows people to see a doctor when they need to?  Or is it another high-deductible shit plan just like the for-profit plans? How can anyone know it's "an option" until they actually SEE it and what's in it? And indeed how can we be sure that the whole "national non-profit plan" won't simply disappear en route, just like the much-vaunted "local health care clinics" did?

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