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View Diary: Gun Safety: What Just Happened in My Family (235 comments)

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  •  Yeah, shotguns aren't rifles, just (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    gerrilea, chimene
    •  Well, yeah. No kidding. Did I say shotgun (21+ / 0-)

      somewhere? I know guns very, very well--almost as well as my brother. I am aware of what a shotgun is. I am also aware of what a rifle is.

      “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

      by jeff in nyc on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 04:32:45 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Sorry. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        gerrilea, ban nock

        I took this to mean that you didn't know.

        It was a rifle, but I don't know (1+ / 0-)
        which one. They were turkey hunting, and I guess that's what they use.
        Not really something to get touchy about. I obviously dont' know you.
        •  Read that different... (5+ / 0-)

          that he didn't know what kind of rifle, since I'm assuming the hunter brother has a couple of different ones for different prey, but I can see how you might have read it differently.

          •  It seems Jeff was referring to what his (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            jeff in nyc, mungley, ThatSinger

            brother uses, not what turkey hunters in general might use.

            My interpretation.

            •  Where I'm from, most people use (12+ / 0-)

              rifles for turkey, because they don't want to mess up the dressed meat.

              “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

              by jeff in nyc on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 06:30:50 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Makes sense. A turkey full of shot (5+ / 0-)

                might not be so tasty.  Or even edible!

                •  I don't hunt turkeys, but from what I've heard (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  jeff in nyc, 43north

                  they shoot them in the head with shotguns also. distances are close and they use a choke. They are big birds and tough. I posted this vid once, the caller and the girl are both very well known. most out here use a shotgun.

                  How big is your personal carbon footprint?

                  by ban nock on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 07:12:59 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Some use shotguns; most use rifles. As a hunter (4+ / 0-)

                    You'll know this is correct. I'm puzzled why you think it's a a close shot though--it most certainly is not.

                    “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

                    by jeff in nyc on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 07:17:53 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  probably better I say nothing. (1+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      duckhunter

                      How big is your personal carbon footprint?

                      by ban nock on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 07:22:33 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  Dude wth? Please explain. I consider that (4+ / 0-)

                        Comment very incendiary and I want to know what you mean.

                        “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

                        by jeff in nyc on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 07:34:48 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  If you thought it best not to comment (3+ / 0-)
                          Recommended by:
                          LilithGardener, ThatSinger, Miggles

                          Why did you do precisely that. If you have a problem with me, then spell it out.

                          “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

                          by jeff in nyc on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 08:48:45 PM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

                          •  Typical condescending comment from one of the (1+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            jeff in nyc

                            "my knowledge of guns trumps all your silly concerns about guns" crowd...  usual suspect...

                            Glad everyone is OK... hopefully that "lesson learned" sticks...

                            Baby, where I come from...

                            by ThatSinger on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 10:52:37 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Here's another opinion on the "common use" (2+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            KVoimakas, ban nock

                            of rifles.
                            http://www.turkeycountrymagazine.com/...

                            For those who would prefer "the bullet":

                            The trend in state hunting regulations in the last three decades has been to move away from rifles for turkey hunting. In 1983, 11 states allowed rifles for spring turkey hunting and 15 allowed rifles for fall turkey hunting. By 1992, this had decreased to nine and 14 states, respectively. In 2009, six states allowed rifles for spring turkey hunting, at least at some times and in some areas, and nine states allow fall turkey hunting with rifles in at least some areas of the state.
                            In addition to the legality, safety, ethical and edibility factors, there is one other reason that many hunters prefer shotguns to rifles for turkey hunting. The appeal and challenge of turkey hunting lies in calling a gobbler into close range; (less than 40 yards), then making a clean, one-shot kill. To these hunters, shooting a turkey at long range with a rifle takes the challenge away from the hunt.
                            So, if you have ever wondered why your state wildlife agency doesn’t allow rifles for turkey hunting, now you know the facts. Traditions are hard to change. Turkey hunters need to make a commitment to what is best for all hunters and the wild turkey. — James Earl Kennamer, Ph.D., NWTF chief conservation officer

                            "The bill's sponsor has a better chance of being the next Pope" ~ attributed to Rep. Eric Burlison of Missouri

                            by 43north on Tue Mar 12, 2013 at 05:43:14 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Besides those reasons....... (3+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            43north, KVoimakas, ban nock

                            ....a turkey won't have enough mass to stop a bullet. The bullet will proceed until it hits something to stop it....maybe a .22 would stay in the bird....maybe.

                            I always thought most turkeys were taken with a shotgun.

                            Rule #7...If you supported the Iraq war, you don't get to complain about the national debt.

                            by suspiciousmind on Tue Mar 12, 2013 at 06:16:01 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  People really do use rifles for turkey where (0+ / 0-)

                            we live. I'm sorry you assume I'm a liar. Shame on you.

                            “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

                            by jeff in nyc on Tue Mar 12, 2013 at 12:22:32 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  I find it absurd that you are so worked up (0+ / 0-)

                            that folks shoot turkeys with rifles down here. Having read a bit on hunting forums this morning, it seems that rifle hunting for turkeys is considered pretty lazy and low-class. But a lot of people here use them because they just want the bird.

                            My diary is not at all about the ethical considerations of hunting, and has nothing at all to do with hunter disagreements about the best way to hunt turkey. I could not care less about that.

                            I was wrting about a family near-catastrophe that affected me deeply and which I ventured to share--I cannot believe your response.

                            “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

                            by jeff in nyc on Tue Mar 12, 2013 at 01:49:09 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                  •  When I majored in wildlife biology in the late (4+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    ban nock, LilithGardener, Paul1a, Miggles

                    sixties we were taught that wild turkeys were not indigenous to the western U.S. As far as I know, everything in Utah was introduced.

                    There can be no protection locally if we're content to ignore the fact that there are no controls globally.

                    by oldpotsmuggler on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 08:29:18 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  After your comment I went looking for maps and (0+ / 0-)

                      they all seemed contradictory.  Probably some interesting history there.

                      A couple nights ago I was reading about a user conflict at a national seashore on Cape Cod. Turns out in exchange for giving up the canned pheasant hunts they got turkeys. I don't know what the draw is but people go crazy over hunting them.

                      Difficulty maybe.

                      How big is your personal carbon footprint?

                      by ban nock on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 08:53:43 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  You should have the decency to spell out (3+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        LilithGardener, ThatSinger, Debby

                        your insulting comment to me, instead of saying "best not to comment" while commenting throughout the diary.

                        “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

                        by jeff in nyc on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 09:06:20 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  Don't expect a reply... (2+ / 0-)
                          Recommended by:
                          LilithGardener, jeff in nyc

                          this is what they do...

                          Baby, where I come from...

                          by ThatSinger on Mon Mar 11, 2013 at 10:53:53 PM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

                        •  The thing to do now is to say, (1+ / 0-)
                          Recommended by:
                          Little

                          "Oh, gosh, I get it now, you were being kind and not correcting me even though I had no idea what I was talking about and kinda got in your face"

                          read 43 north's comments. Almost no one hunts turkeys with a rifle, they are shot at close range. Those are just facts.

                          I could care less, I don't hunt turkeys, I doubt I will in the near future.

                          Why you have to be so belligerent as to call me insulting just because I choose not to embarras you is beyond me. I usually reply to people with the best intentions. If I ever reply to you again please bear that in mind.

                          How big is your personal carbon footprint?

                          by ban nock on Tue Mar 12, 2013 at 06:53:10 AM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

                          •  That's fine. I don't know why my brother (0+ / 0-)

                            uses rifles. It is no embarrassment to me. I just didn't know what you were talking about.

                            “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

                            by jeff in nyc on Tue Mar 12, 2013 at 10:19:58 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Also, this may be a matter of how you (0+ / 0-)

                            look at things. The only kind of hunting I did growing up is dove hunting and deer hunting. The way we did the deer hunting is probably not as sporting as the way serious hunters did it. We shot very close range from a permanent stand. So, when I see how far people are from turkeys, it looks far to me. And it looks like a pretty tiny target for a rifle. Again--I am familiar with these things from growing up, but I have not hunted in many many years and have no wish to.

                            “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

                            by jeff in nyc on Tue Mar 12, 2013 at 11:58:59 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  I'm not feeling too generous to you. You were (0+ / 0-)

                            Both insulting as hell for no reason.. and wrong.

                            “liberals are the people who think that cruelty is the worst thing that we do” --Richard Rorty Also, I moved from NYC, so my username is inaccurate.

                            by jeff in nyc on Tue Mar 12, 2013 at 02:47:31 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                  •  I thought more by far used shotguns than rifles. (3+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    duckhunter, ER Doc, ban nock

                    Which was the motivation for my first comment. But the world has changed since I was into guns, a lot.

                    The forums I'm looking at indicate it's illegal in some states to hunt turkey with a rifle.

                    http://thefiringline.com/...

                    •  I would want to know the calibre, (3+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      Little, 43north, ban nock

                      but I would imagine the cavitation caused by a bullet would tear up the breast meat, barring a .22 or something very small.

                      That's why most bird hunters use shot guns, pellets are easy to clean and they cause far less damage than bullets (just ask Dick Cheney's hunting partners). It takes very little damage to kill a bird.

                      •  I've seen a Tom turkey take a full blast (3+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        ban nock, jfromga, Little

                        of 12 gauge in the body, shake it off like rain, and continue after the hens.

                        The NYPD officer I was with (who shot-at the bird) needed to be restrained, as using his issue 9mm Glock would have been contrary to State Fish & Game regulations.

                        "Head shot" is required on wild turkey as their feathers are effective armor.
                        Which along with the adult bird's vigilance and excellent running and flying skills, makes them a difficult bird for any predator to kill.

                        Most "kill" to natural causes happens to eggs, chicks and juvenile birds.

                        "The bill's sponsor has a better chance of being the next Pope" ~ attributed to Rep. Eric Burlison of Missouri

                        by 43north on Tue Mar 12, 2013 at 05:49:37 AM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

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