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  •  Ok, so here could be two possible memes: (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dark UltraValia, Paul1a, radarlady

    The left wing meme could be that the USPS would be profitable if it weren't for the retirement pre-funding requirement.

    The right wing meme could be that the USPS would be losing billions of dollars even if you ignore the retirement pre-funding requirement.

    Is it better for each of us to go with the meme that supports our political philosophy or is it better to pick the one that is reality based?

    As you know, there are news reports out there from fairly reputable companies that delve into this issue and they have been given to you in the past.  It also looks like the financial report for 2012 will be coming out next month.  Care to take a guess which position more accurately reflects the reality described in the financials?

    While we're at it, here's some more memes:

    The left wing meme is that right wingers lie to themselves to make themselves feel better about supporting bad policies.

    The right wing meme is that left wingers lie to themselves to make themselves feel better about supporting bad policies.

    Which meme are you giving proof of in your posts on the USPS?

    We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them. Albert Einstein

    by theotherside on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 11:50:48 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  I'm just posting my two cents. :-) n/t (6+ / 0-)
    •  Let's see. We should guess on which (9+ / 0-)

      meme is more accurate?  I'm not quite ready to base my opinion on reports from "fairly reputable companies".

      What we do all know, without having to guess, is that no other company or agency is required to have the pension funding required of the USPS.  And no one has yet provided a rational explanation for the much more stringent requirements.  That says something right there about which meme is likely more accurate.

      "If you trust you are not critical; if you are critical you do not trust" by our own Dauphin

      by gustynpip on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 04:32:36 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Here's two links (0+ / 0-)

        http://money.cnn.com/...

        The other is a Reuters opinion piece.

        http://blogs.reuters.com/...

        The losses they cite are similar although there is a disparency in the amount of loss just due to operating expenses vs revenue.  The official financials will likey come out next month (if last year's publish date is any indication) and we'll see who is more accurate.

        I don't know which figures are correct but the key takeaway is that many on the left are deluding themselves when they say that the only reason for the losses are due to pre-funding the retirement fund.  I merely would prefer to be a part of a group that bases their opinions on fact/reality and not wishful thinking or group think memes without any evidence.  There's too much of that on the right and it's not an attribute worthy of importing on the left, IMO.

        We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them. Albert Einstein

        by theotherside on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 05:50:21 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  But no one saying that's the only reason. They're (0+ / 0-)

          saying we don't know, but that's certainly a huge part of the cause.  Sorry you seem incapable of grasping that.  Of course, misinterpreting them does enable you to feel soooo superior, doesn't it?

          "If you trust you are not critical; if you are critical you do not trust" by our own Dauphin

          by gustynpip on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 08:35:27 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  When I read this: (0+ / 0-)
            The U.S. Postal Service announced a record loss of $15.9 billion for the fiscal year 2012, which it blamed primarily on a mandate to set aside billions of dollars for a retirement heath fund.
            The Postal Service said that its loss includes $11.1 billion in defaulted payments it owes to "prefund" health benefits for future retirees.
            What I conclude is that the operational losses are somewhere in the ballpark of $4.8 billion.  

            When I read that the President of the NALC said this:

            "that without the mandate, the Postal Service would have lost $2.2 billion this year."
            What I conclude is that in the most optimistic scenarios the operational losses are $2.2 billion.

            When an article is written several months later (with presumably better numbers) that states:

            In fiscal 2012, the USPS experienced an operating deficit of almost $16 billion on revenue of about $65 billion. Granted, this deficit was exacerbated by the fact that the USPS was supposed to make two larger-than-usual retiree health benefits payments last year. But it didn’t pay either. Even if you subtract these additional scheduled payments, the Postal Service would have still run a deficit of more than $10 billion.
            What I conclude is that the operating losses may be as high as $10 billion.

            Taken together it would appear that a reasonable conclusion is that the operating losses are somewhere between $2 billion and $10 billion for last year but we won't know for sure until the official financials are released.  But what people are doing is going on the internet and saying that "the USPS would be running at a profit if it weren't for the prefunding requirement."  And the only two reasons they are doing this is either because they are ignorant or because it fits their political bias.  What I'm trying to do is bring reason and facts to the debate.  If that makes you feel like that makes me superior that says more about you than me.

            I'm curious though.  After reading these quotes what do you believe the operating deficit was?  And what do you think of people that keep commenting that the USPS would be operating at a profit if not for the 2006 law?

            We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them. Albert Einstein

            by theotherside on Wed Mar 27, 2013 at 04:22:01 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

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