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  •  guy followed them to their home. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    twigg, TacoPie

    under stand your ground, he was seriously wrong.

    •  That's pretty much what (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Smoh, WakeUpNeo

      Zimmerman did .... Followed Trayvon Martin, then claimed self-defense.

      It remains to be seen what the jury will think.

      I hope that the quality of debate will improve,
      but I fear we will remain Democrats.

      Who is twigg?

      by twigg on Fri Mar 29, 2013 at 05:08:28 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  zimmerman followed martin (0+ / 0-)

        around their neighborhood.

        Both had a right to be there, it was a public right of way
        and both had a legal right to be in the street.  

        Now who threw the first punch in the Martin case is unknown and who was escalating it,  is unknown.  It is known that Martin was prevailing and was beating zimmerman and zimmerman pulled his gun and fired from zero-zero while on his back.  That is at least consistent with a fight that was being lost badly.

        if this guy in the video had his gun in his belt and had fired while getting beaten, it would still not be legal self defense because he had no right to be on their property.

        •  Actually, I don't think that is quite right. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Smoh

          Zimmerman was not simply walking around a neighborhood that he had a right to be in .... He was purposefully following Trayvon MArtin, having just been told not to.

          That act of following might easily have been interpreted as threatening ... I know I would have felt uncomfortable about being followed.

          Zimmerman was the instigator from start to finish, he has no self-defense claim that should stand a chance of sucess, but this is Florida in 20122, so who knows.

          I hope that the quality of debate will improve,
          but I fear we will remain Democrats.

          Who is twigg?

          by twigg on Fri Mar 29, 2013 at 05:32:18 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Except that the person who told him not to (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            patbahn

            was a non-emergency dispatcher and thus had no authority to give such an order.  Whether or not that little loophole will save him is another matter.

            You have watched Faux News, now lose 2d10 SAN.

            by Throw The Bums Out on Fri Mar 29, 2013 at 07:46:37 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  even if he was following (0+ / 0-)

            would it be reasonable to attack your follower?

            if you get followed down the road, you should head back to the 7-11 and call the cops or head to a inhabited place and seek help.

            If you are right, then Martin escalated a goofy situation.

            •  Martin escalated nothing (0+ / 0-)

              an armed stranger following him is where the escalation occurred... a woman I sing with recounted the following that happened to her recently... our group rehearses at Howard University on tuesday nights and she was driving home from our rehearsal a few weeks ago when she noticed a car riding close to her bumper... she'd speed up and the car would speed up; she'd slow down and it would slow down; she'd change lanes and it would too...afraid, she called 911 and said there was a car following her and could they send a car to help... she also called her husband and told him what was happening and that she was almost home and to be at the door in case this nut tried to  accost her... she got home and exiting her car she hears  her 911 call on the police radio of the car that was following her... at which point he turned on his lights when he realized the stalker she was calling 911 about and he was being called to investigate...was himself...

              The officer was reprimanded and the police department gave her a written apology for his actions... but that could have been really tragic... for absolutely nothing. She was not pulled over; she received no summons and she committed no offense...

              Fear doesn't just breed incomprehension. It also breeds a spiteful, resentful hate of anyone and everyone who is in any way different from you.

              by awesumtenor on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 11:10:17 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

        •  Legal or not (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Smoh, patbahn, WakeUpNeo

          it's still creepy.

          If someone was following me around at night I'd probably start wondering if he was up to no good.

          Plenty of things that are legal are not particularly smart.

          Once again, he was trying to play macho tough guy and someone got beat up and another person got shot.

          Nobody knows what words were exchanged prior to the fight - it still could have been avoided.

          If the pilot's good, see, I mean if he's reeeally sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low... oh you oughta see it sometime. It's a sight. A big plane like a '52... varrrooom! Its jet exhaust... frying chickens in the barnyard!

          by Major Kong on Fri Mar 29, 2013 at 05:40:02 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  a man who should have stayed in his car (0+ / 0-)

            Is how you could title both the youtube video
            and George Zimmerman.

            Had both stayed in their cars, and called the cops, it would have been easier for a lot of people.

            we know what happened in NC because one kid stayed to get video (That kid should become a newsphotographer or combat journalist).  

            We don't know what happened in FL.  Did Martin freak out and attack his follower?  Did Zimmerman initiate a fight.

            without that i suspect it will be reasonable doubt and then a messy civil trial

    •  I'll simplify it again (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Smoh, WakeUpNeo

      he was seriously wrong -

      Period.

      Under any normal standards of human behavior.

      Full stop.

      Even if he was legal, which is another discussion altogether, he was still stupid and an asshole.

      So we've got two people punched, a couple of people threatened with a firearm and charges filed just because he had to play macho guy.

      If the pilot's good, see, I mean if he's reeeally sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low... oh you oughta see it sometime. It's a sight. A big plane like a '52... varrrooom! Its jet exhaust... frying chickens in the barnyard!

      by Major Kong on Fri Mar 29, 2013 at 05:36:11 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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