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View Diary: Let the tea-leaf reading commence: Supreme Court hears arguments on marriage equality (153 comments)

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  •  okay (0+ / 0-)

    then being the most passionate christian you know is not relavent...  i get it...  a lot of things don't make sense to you...  it is a wonder that some of us can communicate at all...  

    who said it was aimed at religious institutions?  I didn't but to be honest it does have implications...  just as homosexuals are ostracized in this country so are christians by many groups today.

    granted so called christians like westboro don't help...

    but as passionate as you are for this issue so am I and my sacred beliefs...  

    fact is they conflict...  do we discuss them or just fall into factions?  i believe every one should have equal protection in the basic needs of humans under the law.  should same sexes be able to marry...i know they should not...  do they have the right... heck yeah, I can not stop you...  

    I may not be deep, but I am very wide... Honree Balzac

    by meknow on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 09:51:27 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  First, the comment I made (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      zinger99

      about the individual I work with is in another thread.  If you would restrict your comments to the correct thread, then your comments might make more "sense".

      Second, you can hold whatever personal beliefs you wish.  I truly couldn't care less.

      What I do care about is when the state codifies personal beliefs into law which restrict the civil rights of others.

      •  Not caring about the personal beliefs of others is (0+ / 0-)

        a bit of the troubles we face in this and other matters.  Im not going anywhere and I don't suspect you and your bunch are.  Not caring about how each other feels will bring consequences.  

        you think not...

        as they say on the Island...Respect...  I give it and expect it...

        I may not be deep, but I am very wide... Honree Balzac

        by meknow on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 11:42:48 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Respect (0+ / 0-)
          I'm just wondering why would gays or homosexuals want to be justified under what the bible says since they are so dismissive of God and the other commandment other than marriage...  seems hypocritical to me...
          is not what you gave.

          Also, I am not a "bunch".

          You appear not to know the meaning of the word "respect".

          •  because i gave an opinion that did not agree with (0+ / 0-)

            yours i did not respect you...  so respect would be to lie to you and tell you i think it is okay... that would be fear, intimidation or out right lying...

            I may not be deep, but I am very wide... Honree Balzac

            by meknow on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 08:30:42 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  You showed disrespect in your very first comment (0+ / 0-)

              right off the bat by calling people hypocrites, which everyone can see.  It had nothing to do with your opinion, so stop trying to play the poor little victim.  You had the opportunity to state your opinion respectfully, and you utterly failed to do it.

              You deserved whatever push back from everyone that you got.

              •  Where did I call you a hypocrit...? (0+ / 0-)

                Puss back is love to me Edwardssl...  I am sure I did not call you that but I will call you super sensitive...  what is up with that man...  

                Do you know who and what you are (i mean being a hypocrit or not)...  name calling does not shake a confident man.  

                I can promise you that I will avoid commenting on your comments because there is too much drama.  I personally welcome opposition to my views.  Good constructive criticism.  I learn of my opponents or enemies by it.  

                An old saying you may do well to learn..."Iron sharpeneth Iron"  Don't be afraid of opposition.  If you are right and the truth is in your theme you have nothing to worry about but if you are depending on semantics or cleverness you will be in hot water or deep do do...

                try to loosen up and calm down and know your angle Ed...

                I mean you no harm...  If I am wrong prove me so...  I try to avoid pissing contests with people who are paranoid or what ever but sometimes my human side wakes up strong and I get drawn in.  

                What I said from the beginning is that you have the right to do what ever you want to do.  God allows it how can I stop you.  But at the same time I will give my opinion.  I am a member of kos, I am respective of the rules and regulations and will abide by them.  

                But I will give you this, on any thread you are on if you do not want me to participate then message me and I will do it for you.  There are enough threads on here for the both of us.  

                I just kind of thought that people came here for dialogue and not to be coddled and po po'ed

                I may not be deep, but I am very wide... Honree Balzac

                by meknow on Wed Mar 27, 2013 at 10:46:58 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

    •  No, I don't think you're passionate (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      terrypinder, edwardssl

      You are doing a very nice job at posting similar things in several comments. But what you're not doing is facing the hard questions. Questions about what it means to hold an idea sacred, or what it means to coexist with people of a different faith.

      In particular, at least from my point of view, you're not responding to me. And I'm asking you those kinds of questions. With, if I do say so myself, passion.

      I'd like to see your response to this.
      Or this.

      Or, most especially, this.

      Being passionate about your beliefs takes more than just yelling them very loudly. I won't hold my breath for those responses.

      "All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others." -Douglas Adams

      by Serpents Choice on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 10:16:39 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I assume this is for me although I never said that (0+ / 0-)

        I was compassionate.  That was a fellow that told me that they had an employee that was the most compassionate christian they knew.  I asked to explain what a compassionate christian is...

        I will read your matters and give comment...

        I may not be deep, but I am very wide... Honree Balzac

        by meknow on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 11:45:52 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I said passionate, not compassionate. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          edwardssl

          Your argument through this entire thread has been to say that you would wish that others not be granted the ability to marry freely the people they love, solely because your faith would not hold such a union sacred.

          Believe me, I never mistook that argument for a compassionate one.

          "All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others." -Douglas Adams

          by Serpents Choice on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 12:34:44 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  show me a post where I said that... (0+ / 0-)

            what i said is that you have the right to do as you please but I do not think it kosher...  why do you put words in my mouth...  is it a habit?

            I may not be deep, but I am very wide... Honree Balzac

            by meknow on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 01:18:39 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Here you go (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              terrypinder, edwardssl, bluegrass50

              Of course, you pretty much never say what you're talking about directly.  Your posts are full of this sort of florid dancing around your point.  It's not a novel tactic to me. You want to be able to turn around and say "I didn't say that!" when someone draws the conclusions you want them to draw.

              then why does it matter that it be marriage which gets your panties in a was with the right wing...  just call it what you want and fight for the taxes and what ever else
              Followed shortly by:
              I am a Christian...  but I can't stop you from doing anything... if God gives you that right how can I stop you...  but I have the right to oppose what I think is not healthy or right as do you...  i give that right to you...  why do you go right wing on m
              Now, you can pretend that you meant something else, but -- to the extent that your words are ever clear -- they were clear here.  You do not want gays to have "marriage".  You don't care about tax filings or the like, but you've got a problem with the word.  And then, pressed on the issue, you "have the right to oppose" it.

              You do have that right. It is an opinion, and everyone is allowed those. If you're going to engage in argument with others based on that opinion, though, you'd better be willing to explain it and to justify it.

              If you think I'm misquoting you, or that everyone else here is attributing opinions to you that you don't hold, that's very easy to fix.  You are free to clarify your stance: what is wrong with same-sex marriage that caused you to jump into these comments in the first place?

              "All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others." -Douglas Adams

              by Serpents Choice on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 01:51:31 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  I don't agree with same sex marriage... (0+ / 0-)

                i have a Spiritual reason which is found in the Word of God.
                and having been a skeptic i also looked at it from a practical reason...

                men and men and women and women can not produce children.  Therefore you are committing to being parasitic or having to live off the act of procreation by others.  You can not go to a shangrla or exist without us.  If you are left to the laws of nature what would your plight be...

                I have no fear of homosexuals.  I stepped into this discussion because I have the right to do so.  Just as you have exercised your right to do so.  

                I have no problem living next door to a homosexual if he or she does not have a problem with me.  I have no problem with the government fixing taxes for them job benefits.  But I think the practice is not right.  Some people believe in the Republican way some the liberal, some the democratic.. it is the freedom and they all are free to discuss how they feel...  

                I may not be deep, but I am very wide... Honree Balzac

                by meknow on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 02:07:41 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  And so my earlier question stands (3+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  terrypinder, edwardssl, bluegrass50

                  You have a religious objection to homosexuality.  You also have a ... sort of ... non-religious objection to homosexuality, although I think we both know the problems with the childbearing argument.  Although ... really?  I'm parasitic because I don't have kids?  I work 50 hours a week, so I'm pretty sure I'm not a parasite. I just won't leave a genetic legacy behind when I die, but that's fine with me; plenty of other people do, and I'll be dead, so won't care...

                  But my first question is: why does it matter to you if homosexuals marry? Denying them actual marriage is not going to stop homosexuality. You clearly understand that marriage is important to people who desire to marry. You realize, too (I hope) that marriage is not a strictly Christian tradition; a couple need not be Christian to marry. They would have a different marriage than you would, certainly. But why does it bother you that they might have a marriage at all?

                  I suppose that's related to my personal question. My fiancee, even before her current medical crisis, could not have further children. Were we to marry, it would be a childless marriage. And I -- well, the Bible's opinion about nonbelievers is probably even less flattering than its opinion of gays.  "They are corrupt, they do abominable deeds, there is none who does good." (Psalm 14:1). I beg to differ with that, of course, but I want to know your argument here on your grounds. Why is it fine for me, who the word of your God deems abominable and corrupt to dedicate my life and love to a marriage physically incapable of producing children ... but it is not okay for another couple to marry, even if they are equally dedicated, because the reason they are "abominable" and childless is that they have matching genitals?

                  Or is your opinion that, if things were as you would prefer them to be, that I not be permitted to marry, either?

                  "All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others." -Douglas Adams

                  by Serpents Choice on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 02:28:44 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  SC (0+ / 0-)

                    how can I get to marrying when I don't agree with the practice.  homosexual practice being wrong according to the bible is as far as I need to go.  but as i said i still have that skeptic mindset in me.  

                    i know parasite is a tough word...  but you made yourself clear to me on down when you said you would be dead...  your reasoning is that nothing matters but your little time here on earth... see you are not an atheist after all.  you are a fatalist.

                    either you can't read or you have a problem comprehending...  how many times do I need to say that I am not trying to stop anyone from marrying anyone.  How can I.  And I said the same thing about homosexuals being around since the 13th chapter of Genesis.  Read the 19th.  

                    14th number of psalms was when israel was in babylon in captivity.  this was thought to be either haggi or daniel lamenting on the wickedness of the chaledeans...

                    we are not as far a part as you try to make it...seem

                    I may not be deep, but I am very wide... Honree Balzac

                    by meknow on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 03:20:08 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

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