Skip to main content

View Diary: Discovery of His NRA Membership Instantly Ended Possibility of Me Hiring Independent Contractor (1257 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  If he had not had the sticker on... (35+ / 0-)

    ...you likely would never had known.  You might have hired him.  He might have done good work at a reasonable price.  

    Somehow, this is a good thing you've done?

    Maybe if you had asked what he thinks about certain issues, you might have learned that he agrees with you on many things.  Maybe you could have talked, and both come away with a better understanding of one another's beliefs?  Maybe he's a hunter who doesn't feel anyone needs an assault weapon?  Maybe he believes in universal background checks?  Such people do exist in the NRA membership.  Maybe you would have learned that not all gun owners are as bad as you imagine them to be.  Maybe he would have learned that not all liberals are as bad as the NRA tells them he is?    

    But instead, you chose to make a conclusion based on tendencies you've ascribed to the person based on out-group stereotyping.  It's no better than any other decision about a person based on stereotype.

    It really pains me to see these types of diaries where we work so hard to convince ourselves that our stereotyping is so much better than that of the other side.  Somehow, ours is more pure, our stereotyping has more fidelity than theirs.  

    Bullshit.          

    •  Agreed. (11+ / 0-)

      I don't think people should necessarily be judged by stickers on their vehicles. NRA members are not evil by definition. I really think it's a small minority plus their leadership who are insane. Don't forget that not all that long ago even the crazy Wayne LaPierre was calling for universal background checks. If someone joined the NRA during that time of sanity, maybe as a lifetime member, is it fair to judge them now when the leadership has gone stark raving bonkers?

      I very probably would judge people by their stickers if they were supporting hate groups. White supremacists need not apply for a job with me! But I just can't support the thinking that the NRA is a hate group. There are members of any group who are haters, but that doesn't spoil the whole group unless it's in their mission statement.

      Came for the politics, stayed for the pooties.

      by DreamyAJ on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 11:20:06 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Oh, it's easy to judge people based on stickers (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        gerrilea

        but it requires a lot more than just one, and especially one that represents a multitude of mindsets (as you said).

        Now if the guy had an "O'Bummer" and a "Romney/Ryan" sticker, you could start to get a better picture.

        •  Even deluded people who supported (0+ / 0-)

          Romney/Ryan and engage in stupid name-calling of the President aren't necessarily evil and unworthy of hire. On the other hand, if they're that deluded, maybe that's enough...

          Came for the politics, stayed for the pooties.

          by DreamyAJ on Wed Apr 03, 2013 at 02:03:04 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  Not stereotyping (17+ / 0-)

      I'll explain, since you're not one of those who wants to portray owners of home arsenals as oppressed minorities. A stereotype is judging someone based on their appearance or culture.  A bumper sticker is an announcement about yourself that you ask to be judged by. If they had a swastika or a KKK sticker, would that be enough to make you avoid entering an intimate business relationship with a stranger?

      •  Yes, (8+ / 0-)

        NRA = Nazis
        NRA = KKK

        Hyperbole much?  

        Most of us live in a world that has lots of shades of gray.

        I don't recall the NRA setting up concentration camps, frankly. But go ahead with your bizarre analogies.

        Sigh....

        © grover


        So if you get hit by a bus tonight, would you be satisfied with how you spent today, your last day on earth? Live like tomorrow is never guaranteed, because it's not. -- Me.

        by grover on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 11:33:06 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  The point of an analogy (9+ / 0-)

          is that it is not the thing itself, and hyperbole is used to illustrate a more subtle distinction. It shows a certain facility with words that you use them, but they do not mean waht you think. Your attempt to put extreme claims in my mouth is either an unfortunate failing in your education in classical rhetoric, or disingenuous trollery.

        •  NRA=KKK (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Sandino, trumpeter

          I might have to research that one.  Michael Moore certainly conflated the two in "Bowling for Columbine".  It isn't such an easy comparison to dismiss.

          "Goodnight, thank you, and may your God go with you"

          by TheFern on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 12:01:49 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  I don't think that's a fair accusation. (9+ / 0-)

          Sandino was discussing, "Is a sticker enough?" to make such a decision and "How radical of a sticker does it take?"

          So, if someone would make a decision regarding say, a KKK sticker, then a sticker is enough to make the decision.

          Are we all OK with that?

          So, then, what if the sticker is another symbol or group with which the homeowner disagrees.  Is that enough?

          In my view, yes.  A sticker is enough to make a decision.  If you'd do it for a severe or evil radical group, you can do it for another group.   I'd do it for a silver fish or a Baptists Rule! sticker too.  That's just me.

          If that sticker were on the corner grocery's front door, that would be enough for me too.  

          It's a business, whether there is a front door down the street or a pickup truck in my driveway, it is a business, and I decide who gets my spending dollars.

          "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

          by YucatanMan on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 12:14:11 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  It absolutely IS stereotyping. (8+ / 0-)

        You (and the diarist) are making a lot of assumptions about that person based on one stupid sticker on his truck. You and the diarist know nothing about him, aside from the fact that he seemed to be amiable and his services reasonably priced. His NRA sticker doesn't tell you what he believes about guns, as the vast majority of NRA members disagree with the NRA about a lot of its positions. I personally know NRA members who are pretty anti-gun, who are only members of the NRA because they're hunters. The diarist is just assuming something about him based on a preconceived notion about what people with NRA stickers on their cars might be like. That's pretty much the definition of stereotyping.

        "In an individual, selfishness uglifies the soul; for the human species, selfishness is extinction." -Cloud Atlas, by David Mitchell

        by rigcath on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 11:50:00 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Hunters do NOT have to belong to the NRA (7+ / 0-)

          That's the point. If you belong to an organization and have a sticker on your vehicle that you use to work in, then you are announcing to the world that you support that organization in all it does.

          Otherwise, why announce it? Why belong?

          Women create the entire labor force. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sympathy is the strongest instinct in human nature. - Charles Darwin

          by splashy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 12:02:46 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  You know, I was married in a Catholic Church (6+ / 0-)

            If I announce that fact, it does not mean I support pedifile priests.  No, it does not mean I support that orgainization in ALL it does.  Now I don't give the church money, but I'm allowed to agree with some things and disagree with others.  

          •  Who knows why he has the sticker? THAT's the point (5+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Isara, gerrilea, noway2, fuzzyguy, ancblu

            I have an Obama 2012 sticker on my car. Does that mean I support everything he's ever done and stands for--including pushing for market-based education reform, chained CPI, drone strikes, failing to close Guantanamo Bay, refusing to prosecute the banks and bankers who caused the recession, etc.? More importantly, would it be correct to assume that I do? Proclaiming support for an idea, person, group, etc. does not mean that I support it fully--and you're just assuming (absurdly) that the dude with the NRA sticker on his truck is doing that.

            "In an individual, selfishness uglifies the soul; for the human species, selfishness is extinction." -Cloud Atlas, by David Mitchell

            by rigcath on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 12:24:54 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  The thing is (0+ / 0-)

              Most people would assume that you supported everything he does, especially since you still have the sticker on the car after the election.

              If you only have a few things to go on, and only a small amount of time to make a decision, things like that can make a difference.

              That's why it's foolish to have anything like that on a business vehicle. It can alienate potential customers.

              Women create the entire labor force. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sympathy is the strongest instinct in human nature. - Charles Darwin

              by splashy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 10:11:38 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

          •  Many hunters must go through safety training (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            rigcath, high uintas, fuzzyguy, ancblu

            before they can get their license.  Who does that training mostly? THE NRA.

            I used to have ACLU stickers on my car, does this mean I shouldn't get the job?

            I have no appetite for bigotry, no matter where it comes from.  It only serves to divide us as a nation even further.

            -7.62; -5.95 The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite insane.~Tesla

            by gerrilea on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 12:37:36 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  But do they have to have a sticker (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Sandino

              On their business vehicle?

              Some would not hire you as a contractor if you have ACLU stickers on your car. That's just how it is.

              Stickers = you telling the world what you are into, what is important to you. Those that would hire you to do their work are likely to take that into consideration.

              Women create the entire labor force. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sympathy is the strongest instinct in human nature. - Charles Darwin

              by splashy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 10:13:30 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Would it make a difference if they wore a (0+ / 0-)

                tee-shirt that had a baseball team on it? Or the pompous "designer labels"???

                And since when is supporting one of the amendments in the Bill of Rights a bad thing again?  I thought that was our defining principles as Progressives, the expansion of rights to more people???

                What if they had an EFF (Electronic Frontier Foundation) bumper sticker???

                What you're supporting here is the discrimination and division of our society.

                Did it ever occur to you that this contractor may have refused to do the work if he found out you were a "tree hugging liberal"???

                What if he saw your I-Phone or Blackberry and refused to do work for someone whom supports slave labor and the destruction of the environment and the subjugation of the human race?  

                What I find truly odd here is you blame the contractor for your bigotry, hatred and fear.

                Question:
                Do you blame women for being raped too?

                And just because "that's how it is" is not a legitimate defense or excuse that negates your responsibility for your hypocritical actions here.

                -7.62; -5.95 The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite insane.~Tesla

                by gerrilea on Wed Apr 03, 2013 at 12:10:39 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

          •  You have binary vision in an analogue world. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            ancblu

            Good luck with that.

            Your hate-mail will be graded.

            by PavePusher on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 06:39:51 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •   (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          codairem, Miggles, Sandino

          Hey, if you have a sticker on your car for an organization, it can be assumed that you put it there.  Since you put it there, and have not removed it, it can be assumed that you support that organization, its goals, and its actions.

          ...Given how off-the-rails the NRA has gone in the last couple of years, this means that you support an insane, antisocial organization, are more-likely-than-not armed, and you may or may not be carrying concealed.  Either you're politically oblivious -- which is a forgiveable offense -- or you're a fucking nutjob, which is not.  Given the higher risks of death involved with interacting with an armed nutjob, not hiring them to hang around your house for days or weeks is, frankly, a logical action.

          Five years ago, I'd agree with you.  Now, to many people, you might as well slap a NAMBLA sticker on your car as an NRA one -- at least NAMBLA doesn't support -shooting- little children.

    •  You are advocating purity as well (11+ / 0-)

      insisting that there is inherent benefit in rewarding those with opposing belief systems. The diarist states the NRA member was one of several potential candidates for hire, though he was the leading candidate. But given several competing parties, there are reasons to say "no." Just as an empty bottle of Jack in the back of the truck might have raised a red flag, in this case it was NRA membership. NRA have to realize they are creating damaging perceptions among non-members. I see no problem with NRA members having to live with potentially damaging consequences caused by their advocacy. People on the other side aren't playing around anymore. They are tired of the implicit threat of violence, tired of the secessionist rhetoric and the white supremacist overtones. An NRA member has every right to let their freak flag fly, but they have no right to expect others not to take offense.

    •  If this were true (6+ / 0-)
      Maybe he's a hunter who doesn't feel anyone needs an assault weapon?  Maybe he believes in universal background checks?  Such people do exist in the NRA membership.
      Then I don't understand why they are in the NRA.

      Sending money to the NRA in the form of dues supports no background checks on criminals, no studies on the effects of guns on our lives and society, and sneaking around with your gun taking away the rights of others to decide for themselves if they want to trust you with that gun.

      Women create the entire labor force. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sympathy is the strongest instinct in human nature. - Charles Darwin

      by splashy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 12:00:26 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Jeez, diarist is adding a room, not finding a (10+ / 0-)

      candidate for president.  Who has time to grill contractors on politics?

      Nobody, but when someone makes it easy by putting a bumper sticker on his truck/car, you already know that one of the things he most wanted you to know was his affiliation with a lobbying organization.   Did it work to win business?  Not this time.

      That's not even "gun control". It's more like "massacre control".

      by Inland on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 01:05:13 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It's the contractor's loss. The concept of (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      cal2010, Kwik

      "first impressions matter" is totally true.  It's not the customer's job to dig deeper and figure out what might be behind that bumper sticker.  Too late for that.  The contractor creeped out the customer.  End of story.

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site