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    •  Every 2-term president (96+ / 0-)

      ... seems to start his second term stepping in a deep pile of shit.  Now, it seems, we have the second one in a row choosing to grab the Third Rail and hang on for dear life.  Democrats had the good sense to fight the last one -- how many will remember that they have to fight this one too?

      If you want to cut Social Security, you're not a real Democrat.

      by Dallasdoc on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 08:34:13 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  No ... (25+ / 0-)
        Democrats had the good sense to fight the last one -- how many will remember that they have to fight this one too?
        because Obama .... and his great smile.

        The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. Bertrand Russell

        by accumbens on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 09:08:13 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Obama's big grin translated: SUCKERS! (14+ / 0-)

          "It depends what the meaning of 'is', is"
          Platform of the Neo-Democratic Party
          Speaking out of one side of their mouth for the little guy, their nominal constituency, and the other for the plutocracy, their real constituency.

          by Sanctimonious on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 09:43:29 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  His great smile won't save him (11+ / 0-)

          Sure, there will always be the sheeple that will accept and defend anything he does. But I believe that most people aren't as stupid as we'd like to give them credit for. There will be enough of us who see this for what it is. This is going to be his Waterloo.

          Personally, I believe this is just a rigged system kicking the ball back over the the Republican side after the GOP has nearly destroyed themselves. The puppet masters know this gives the GOP new life. Democrats will get crushed in the midterms and the rigged game will go on.

          "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why they are poor, they call me a communist." Dom Hélder Pessoa Câmara

          by Haningchadus14 on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 09:52:20 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Save him from what exactly? (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            GAladybug

            In three years he will join Bubba in the golden circle.

            The law, in its majestic equality, gives the rich as well as the poor the right to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to eat dumpster donuts. - With apologies to Anatole France

            by chuckvw on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 12:24:03 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  Personality Politics (8+ / 0-)

          Initially Bush was seen as an Evangelical by the Christian Right. I remember losing what I thought was a friend over this guy. I remember thinking, this guy and his fucked up speeches make C students cheer. There are a lot of C students who managed to slip through life and finally there was one of their own in there. It was the personality. "Heh heh. I'm a fuck-up but look at me".

          Obama had the A students. The intelligent ones. His background spoke of wisdom beyond his years because, My God, he was a Law Professor and a Constitutional law professor at that. What were the Kossacks arguing the most about when he came on the scene? Bush stepping all over the constitution. Remember the great FISA food fight?  The Patriot act. "I want a president who will respect my constitutional rights" was one comment I recall being repeated in many different forms. All of this before we realized the country was sinking into some very deep economic shit.

          It's almost comical to see what caused the RAGE before the Bankers broke the bank.

          We see feeble outcries about the constitution now with the NDAA. But what it really comes down to in this great recession that just won't quit, is survival. This guy is fucking with our ability to survive because he has his.

          There was a massive trickle down change since the time he   took office and refused to slam the window down on the bankers fingers. It is a loss of trust all the way down to the street level. No one trusts anyone anymore. Yet our system once had rules in place to  that makes trust possible. When it became clear that the Rule of Law would stomp a 7/11 candy thief to death and let a thousand bankers who ruined entire countries run free with taxpayer money, then the low life grifters and predators sprung into action.

          Once again scammers reigned. It's everyone for themselves. "Fuck you, I have mine" should be the line that  defines the Obama era. Many of us knew this in 2012. It reminds me of the 80s.

           I voted for him because I have seen what Bain Capital did and how ruthless one had to be, to be in that line of work and successful at it as defined by material gain at someone else's expense. Private equity has always been a zero-sum game. Black Rock now has its hands in just about everything in the country. Romney was truly a ground breaker.

          So I knew I was voting for the status quo which I hated. Obama has been very well insulated by the apologists who go out on sites like this and his inner circle.

           "The Grand Bargain" was what Obama lived for at any cost. He wanted to be seen as a political everyman.  The price? Social Security, Medicare, and other programs that helped those who could no longer help themselves.  The core of being a progressive is being attacked by a Democrat with a ferocity that gives lie to the notion that he couldn't have affected the outcome of the ACA by leaning on congress to do something about the cost of Health Care as in Medicare for all.  He wanted everyone to vote their "conscience". What Conscience? JHC. The lobbyists were out in force.

          Now it's Social security and Medicare. The "entitlements" that have been lumped together with Medicare and Food Stamps. As a freebie. A Handout. They must be cut. Because once you label a once thriving and working program as a entitlement it is then considered free shit.  It's looked at with scorn by those who are on a very different pension plan and gold plated health care plans. Obama is the perfect man to take this third rail on. He's Intelligent. He does great speech. Look at the smile. How can he have a heart of darkness. He is a "great man" . Surely the intellectuals , the A students who have done well in life will understand the "sad need" to balance the needs of state with the needs of the individual. So out they come to tell us , it will be ok. Just like they did when the ACA was being passed. "We'll fix it" . Yeah. Ok, whatever.  

          We got what we voted for and there is too much disorganization to oppose what he stands for . He stands for himself and his place in history or how he perceives it. He is the man that will have bucked his own party to give the crazies a place at the table. Because, as he said in a response to a Kossack  who forgot all his complaints because it was sent to him in a handwritten note " I am the president of everyone and have to take everyones point of view into consideration"...no matter how fucked up a view it is.

          “ Success has a great tendency to conceal and throw a veil over the evil of men. ” — Demosthenes

          by Dburn on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 12:47:18 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Write your congressperson and senators. (4+ / 0-)

        Their independence is the only thing that can save us now.

        The elevation of appearance over substance, of celebrity over character, of short term gains over lasting achievement displays a poverty of ambition. It distracts you from what's truly important. - Barack Obama

        by helfenburg on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 10:06:18 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Indepdence from... (6+ / 0-)

          a Democratic President?  I think you give too much credit to those in the Democratic Party.

          "[I]n the absence of genuine leadership, they'll listen to anyone who steps up to the microphone...They're so thirsty for it they'll crawl through the desert toward a mirage, and when they discover there's no water, they'll drink the sand."

          by cardboardurinal on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 10:54:48 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Yes, independence from the pres. Have you got a (0+ / 0-)

            better idea?  'Cause I'm all ears.

            The elevation of appearance over substance, of celebrity over character, of short term gains over lasting achievement displays a poverty of ambition. It distracts you from what's truly important. - Barack Obama

            by helfenburg on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 03:20:51 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  The hope we have... (0+ / 0-)

              is that Republicans do not want to go with anything Obama tries to do.  It might actually be better to call them and push them to vote against it (posing as a "conservatives").  

              "[I]n the absence of genuine leadership, they'll listen to anyone who steps up to the microphone...They're so thirsty for it they'll crawl through the desert toward a mirage, and when they discover there's no water, they'll drink the sand."

              by cardboardurinal on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 10:54:42 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

      •  Fight with what? (9+ / 0-)

        But fight we must because it's only going to get worse as long as the same people who fought Bush policy so hard continue to defend the guy who refuses to change the direction he steered the country in. Bush tax cuts now permanent? When do you get that genie back?

        My God, I still hear some talking about Obama as the next carving on Mount Rushmore even though the only thing he really seems to give a rat's ass about is pleasing the cool kids in DC by being the first president to begin the dismantling of SS and setting up Wall Street for their next entitlement.

        Is it really worth the money after office to go down as an empty soul?

        Directing the people powered movie starring Howard Dean and YOU!

        by deantv on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:46:02 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Ask Bubba (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          allenjo, George3

          He's filthy rich, Hillary 2016™ is a lock, and Chelsea is on the cover of Parade Magazine.

          The law, in its majestic equality, gives the rich as well as the poor the right to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to eat dumpster donuts. - With apologies to Anatole France

          by chuckvw on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 12:29:02 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  I'm going to go out on a limb… (11+ / 0-)

      …and guess that this wasn't a realistic thing the President wanted, but a negotiating tactic. Obama was told by Boehner that Obama needed to offer chained CPI, but Obama figured the GOP would just say no to anything he proposed, thus he offered chained CPI to show how stubborn and obstructive the GOP is.

      That is the only good reason for putting it in his budget, but optically I think that chess move is a loser.

      The biggest problem is that I think Obama is just the shittiest possible negotiator. But thank god he's there and not Romney.

      Union-printed, USA-made, signs, stickers, swag for everyone: DemSign.com.

      by DemSign on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 10:01:03 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Prez Romney couldn't mobilize Dem support for this (7+ / 0-)

        "I am confident that we're going to be able to leave the Gulf Coast in better shape than it was before." Barack Obama

        by quagmiremonkey on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 10:03:35 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  The Repubs are making too many happy noises. (10+ / 0-)

        Enough of them will join with enough dirty dog Dems to make it happen.

        The elevation of appearance over substance, of celebrity over character, of short term gains over lasting achievement displays a poverty of ambition. It distracts you from what's truly important. - Barack Obama

        by helfenburg on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 10:07:16 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  like it was supposed to happen (5+ / 0-)

          in Decemeber? January? Febuary? March?

          In the time that I have been given,
          I am what I am

          by duhban on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 10:49:01 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  He's got another 45 months to keep trying. (13+ / 0-)

            He hasn't given up after the first 51. He still cites the Simpson-Bowles Catfood Commission as something good.


            If Republicans said every 3rd person named "Smith" should hang, we'd bargain them to every 7th. Then we'll see apologia written praising this most pragmatic compromise. There's our losing formula.

            by Jim P on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:05:40 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  PS: "Democrats WANT to cut your Social Security" (15+ / 0-)

              That HAS already happened.


              If Republicans said every 3rd person named "Smith" should hang, we'd bargain them to every 7th. Then we'll see apologia written praising this most pragmatic compromise. There's our losing formula.

              by Jim P on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:07:05 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  democrats have cut social security? (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                George3

                In the time that I have been given,
                I am what I am

                by duhban on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:16:11 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  That's not what Jim P said. The point is (18+ / 0-)

                  that the Dems already own these cuts, whether they're ever implemented or not.

                  The Republicans will cynically position themselves in 2014 as the last defenders of the safety net.

                  When you triangulate everything, you can't even roll downhill...

                  by PhilJD on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:22:02 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I was asking a question (3+ / 0-)

                    not making an accusation, generally when you include a question mark the intent is to question not accuse

                    And they only 'own' the cuts in your mind the fact is that unless congress does the unthinkable it's a nonstarter and as such will never see a vote and noone up for reelection is effected by it

                    In the time that I have been given,
                    I am what I am

                    by duhban on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:25:54 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  Ever hear of "election ads?" In 2010, ever (5+ / 0-)

                      see how Republicans used "Dems wanted to cut Medicare." Ever see the stats on how many voters that lost?

                      But you strike me as being deliberately obtuse. As usual. So goodbye, let this thread die. Talk about kabuki!


                      If Republicans said every 3rd person named "Smith" should hang, we'd bargain them to every 7th. Then we'll see apologia written praising this most pragmatic compromise. There's our losing formula.

                      by Jim P on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:58:24 AM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  the GOP already accuses the democrats (1+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        LABobsterofAnaheim

                        of this it's hardly believable that suddenly they will sway more seniors

                        But then acknowledging that would require some level of objectivity which I think you are deliberately avoiding so sure thread over you have a good day

                        In the time that I have been given,
                        I am what I am

                        by duhban on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 01:05:38 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  Difference: GOP NOW HAS (0+ / 0-)

                          DIDN'T HAVE BEFORE...

                          NOW HAS...

                          VIDEO TO SHOW THE PEOPLE. OF THE ACTUAL PROPOSAL.

                          You're just pretending to be completely oblivious to reality, aren't you? Noted for future reference.


                          If Republicans said every 3rd person named "Smith" should hang, we'd bargain them to every 7th. Then we'll see apologia written praising this most pragmatic compromise. There's our losing formula.

                          by Jim P on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 01:17:59 PM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

                          •  please take your sanctimony to someone that cares (1+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            LABobsterofAnaheim

                            In the time that I have been given,
                            I am what I am

                            by duhban on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 01:19:17 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Recc'd, even though I shouldn't, because.... (1+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            duhban

                            I get so tired of the all-knowing consensus here.

                            Don't get me wrong, the whole chained CPI business sucks the gigantic phalluses of your choice, and there is some truth to the idea that -- on economic issues -- there does seem to be a kind of unity on the whole Robin Hood in reverse thing. At least that's how I sorta feel tonight.

                            At the same time, I don't know where everyone gets so goddamn sure about how this will play out politically. I honestly don't see the Republicans getting much traction out of this because everyone know they hate SS and half of them would do away with it tomorrow if they could. It takes a special kind of ignorance to vote for almost any surviving Republican to PRESERVE SS or any government program.

                            I really wish people could get their brains around the idea that maybe they don't know, you know, everything.

                            Now residing in Van Nuys, but "LaBobsterofVanNuys" isn't funny and besides, Van Nuys is really part of Los Angeles

                            by LABobsterofAnaheim on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 09:12:45 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                •  "WANT" "WANT" "WANT" "WANT" "WANT" (3+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  aliasalias, SpecialKinFlag, George3

                  Can you not read? That's the Republican ad campaign in 2014. You know that.

                  Of course, if Repubs take this offer, or when Obama repeats it over and over and they take one of those it will be "HAS CUT."


                  If Republicans said every 3rd person named "Smith" should hang, we'd bargain them to every 7th. Then we'll see apologia written praising this most pragmatic compromise. There's our losing formula.

                  by Jim P on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:56:06 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

            •  and at what point does this becomes (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              BenderRodriguez

              the boy who cried wolf?

              It's rather hard to respect argument via emotionalism and hyperbole especially when they keep being wrong. And especially when they ignore actual known facts.

              It looks more like some people here are more looking for anything  no matter how small to attack the president over because of personal issues rather then actual matters of substance

              In the time that I have been given,
              I am what I am

              by duhban on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:08:28 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Really? (22+ / 0-)

                We should ignore The President's proposed budget and website?  It's emotional to react to the President's own website?  

                Right...

                This is why I usually ignore your comments.  The President is being very clear that he wants to implement Chained CPI.  That's not emotion or hyperbole.  

                •  I really do not care if you usually ignore me (0+ / 0-)

                  I do not know you so really what impact do you think you ignoring me has?

                  Hell I didn't even notice till you just said it.

                  And yes really, when people say 'now he's going to cut SS' and he doesn't and then keep saying it at what point does said people lose all crediblity?

                  Good gods there is an article up right now that asserts OBama wants to be the president that destroys SS

                  I've yet to see a single argument not from emotion or hyperbole on this not attacking Obama.

                  At this point I'm thinking this is more about personal dislike of Obama then anything else

                  In the time that I have been given,
                  I am what I am

                  by duhban on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:46:58 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

              •  Since when was Social Security a "personal" (14+ / 0-)

                issue for only one person?

                It affects all of society, plus our economy, as well as retirees, children of deceased parents, the disabled, and more.

                "Personal issue?"  Not Social Security.

                What known facts are people ignoring?  What have we missed?  

                We'd all like to know because it looks grim now.

                "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

                by YucatanMan on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:51:17 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  pretty sure I still don't want to talk to you (0+ / 0-)

                  unless I missed you apology for lying about me

                  In the time that I have been given,
                  I am what I am

                  by duhban on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:55:24 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  A comment posted online is not talking to one (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    zinger99

                    specific person. It is a thought which is viewed by many people. They consequently might express their thoughts, if they feel like it.

                    I'm not necessarily talking "to" you, I'm discussing your comment with the many readers who may (or may not) come across my related comment(s).

                    If you would like to respond to these questions, please do so:

                    What known facts are people ignoring?  What have we missed?  

                    We'd all like to know because it looks grim now.

                    If you don't respond, it might appear to others that you have no facts to back up those statements.  What have we missed?  Tell all those other readers.  Just block me out of your mind, but tell them:  What have we missed?

                    "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

                    by YucatanMan on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 02:12:54 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

              •  Your song is old now (11+ / 0-)

                and the party is over.

                When the president writes a budget that cuts social security, and people get mad and point that out, you can't accuse them of

                emotionalism and hyperbole
                , and you especially can't accuse them of
                being wrong. And especially when they ignore actual known facts.

                The president put that in his budget.  That's a fact.  It's not wrong.  Whether people are emotional about that or not is moot.  He did it, he owns it.

                You seem to be saying that this is ok because the president knows that the GOP won't take the deal.  I think that's a silly argument for two reasons.

                First, because it assumes you have Kreskin-like mindreading powers.  We can't judge what the president does based on how we think he feels about it.  I don't know that.  You don't know that.  There's no way to judge that.  The only things we can judge are his words and his actions.

                And second, because there's no payoff in that approach.  In fact, even if the 11th dimensional chess argument you keep supporting were correct, why the hell would anyone risk cuts to SS, veterans benefits, federal pensions, and tax hikes for the working class in order to put out some budget and not have it accepted?  What's the prize for taking all that risk?   Oh sure, there's a booby prize to go along with it.  Making your party known as "the ones who tried to cut SS", but I see no prize at the bottom of that box of crackerjacks at all.

                Keep smokin that stuff..I hear it might be legal soon.

                •  Stop worrying. Go with the flow. He's got this! (4+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  quagmiremonkey, BlueDragon, Clues, paradox

                  Oh, and you better hit the 7/11 for some Powerball tickets while you're at it.

                •  actually I can (0+ / 0-)

                  because people are accusing Obama of 'rolling back the new deal', 'completely destroying SS' etc etc

                  None of which is true, at best (for your arguments) chained cpi is projected to give less benefits in the long run. That is not rolling back the new deal nor is it destroying SS

                  In point of fact SS is designed by law to automatically cut benefits to meet it's promises to all.

                  So in point of fact hyperbole and emotionalism are dominating the arguments right now.

                  As to your counter points

                  1. Sure I can be wrong but you know just as mind blowing so could you. To me it's unthinkable that any democratic president would seriously want to roll back SS and just as unthinkable that any democrat in Congress would go along with it

                  That's my basis, I know it what is yours?

                  2. there's no benefit in making the gop look even more extreme? you sure about that?

                  In the time that I have been given,
                  I am what I am

                  by duhban on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 01:03:41 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  no. (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    TracieLynn, PhilJD
                    As to your counter points

                    1. Sure I can be wrong but you know just as mind blowing so could you. To me it's unthinkable that any democratic president would seriously want to roll back SS and just as unthinkable that any democrat in Congress would go along with it

                    That's my basis, I know it what is yours?

                    You missed the point.

                    I'm not saying that I believe the president wants this, like you believe he doesn't want this.  I'm saying all those "beliefs" are irrelevant and an invalid argument.

                    So (and this will blow YOUR mind), no, I can't be wrong on this, because I'm not participating in it at all.  I don't know what he thinks, and I don't really care what he thinks.  I do care what he says and what he does, and fortunately for me, that's a matter of public record and not open to your interpretation.

                    And this -  

                    2. there's no benefit in making the gop look even more extreme? you sure about that?
                    Does turning down cuts to SS make them look more extreme?  What curious ideas you have.
                  •  If he doesn't seriously want to (3+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    TracieLynn, mimi9, denise b

                    then why did he task the catfood commission with "reforming" something that in no way adds to the deficit? Why has he put "entitlement reform" on the table in negotiation after negotiation? Why is it the President's starting position instead of something he feels grudgingly forced to concede at the very, very end of a bloody negotiation with the GOP leaership?

                    Organ donors save lives! A donor's kidney gave me my life back on 02/18/11; he lives on in me. Please talk with your family about your wish to donate.

                    Why are war casualty counts "American troops" and "others" but never "human beings"?

                    by Kitsap River on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 02:12:25 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  because SS does need change (0+ / 0-)

                      the estimated solvency keeps being adjusted downward and the obvious and common sense solutions such as removing the payroll tax cap are nonstarters

                      hell even offering chained cpi almost certainly not even be accepted because of the outright fetish the GOP has against taxes

                      In the time that I have been given,
                      I am what I am

                      by duhban on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 08:35:51 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

          •  The fact that the Thugs are too stupid & stubborn (15+ / 0-)

            to take yes for an answer...

            hardly is evidence that the President doesn't actively want these cuts.

            When you triangulate everything, you can't even roll downhill...

            by PhilJD on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:07:38 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  Yeah, I think it really is piss falling on us. (7+ / 0-)

        It's not rain!

      •  I don't know about that... (0+ / 0-)

        I'm all for basing policy and law on more accurate measures (yes, such as Chained CPI, in principle), but abusing them isn't a-okay.  Neglecting to correct for served population demographics either on the inflation computation side or on the payment side qualifies as abuse.  The basic assumption of Chained CPI, while perhaps accurate, also seems a little morally suspect, boiling down to "when stuff gets too expensive, people make do with something totally different or go without instead of just less."

        There's been a lttle fig leaf offered: Pfeiffer said that it would only be acceptable if "... it has protections for the most vulnerable, including the oldest seniors." But that sounds like a phase-in, not a permanent offset to keep quality of life at reasonable levels.

        Not that it really matters anyway - Boehner's already dismissed it and it is difficult to see enough Dems going along.

        Water which is too pure has no fish -- Ts'ai Ken T'an

        by mik on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 10:49:21 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  The entire calculation of inflation is a lie. (19+ / 0-)

          If we used the methods of only about 20 years ago inflation now would be counted at 7%. It's higher for older people.

          And what matters is the 2014 election where Republicans spend $200M or so on ads "Dems tried to cut your Social Security, but we didn't go along."

          It's not even in the Republican budget proposal.

          And anyway, what makes you think Obama won't be offering this up in various formats over the next 3 years and 9 months?


          If Republicans said every 3rd person named "Smith" should hang, we'd bargain them to every 7th. Then we'll see apologia written praising this most pragmatic compromise. There's our losing formula.

          by Jim P on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:11:04 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  He stated this as a goal of his over many years (9+ / 0-)

            ago and brings up "reforming" Social Security over and over, in every election and in many of his speeches.

            Cutting Social Security is one of his long-term goals.

            "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

            by YucatanMan on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:52:55 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Source (0+ / 0-)

              Please.

              Union-printed, USA-made, signs, stickers, swag for everyone: DemSign.com.

              by DemSign on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 12:39:38 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  if you need a source for this (5+ / 0-)

                you haven't watched/read obama's statements in many  high stakes situations, including debates in 2008.

                teh google is your friend

              •  You'll not get a source for "the sun shines" (4+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                YucatanMan, 3goldens, Dallasdoc, zinger99

                either. This is common knowledge. If you wanted it you could get it in under a minute.

                http://www.youtube.com/...


                If Republicans said every 3rd person named "Smith" should hang, we'd bargain them to every 7th. Then we'll see apologia written praising this most pragmatic compromise. There's our losing formula.

                by Jim P on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 12:53:44 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

              •  Here you go, with video from 2006: (7+ / 0-)

                Obama at the Hamilton Project, 2006: “This is not a bloodless process.”

                too many of us have been interested in defending programs the way they were written in 1938....

                ....So there are real consequences to the work that is being done here. This is not a bloodless process.

                (emphasis added)

                There was the 2012 debate with Romney:
                Obama's Social Security Answer Leaves Democrats Utterly Baffled

                "I suspect that on Social Security, we've got a somewhat similar position," Obama said. "Social Security is structurally sound. It's going to have to be tweaked the way it was by Ronald Reagan and Speaker -- Democratic Speaker Tip O'Neill. But it is -- the basic structure is sound."
                ...
                "There is a real difference in philosophy," she said. "For Obama to say that he believes he and Romney agree, either Obama has not been straight about his position on Social Security all these years, or he and his campaign haven't looked at Romney's position."
                Or here in The Atlantic:
                But as Stein notes, during the 2010 debt ceiling negotiations with House Republicans, Obama offered to change the formula to start using the chained CPI instead.
                ...
                Obama hinted that he'd support changing the inflation formula at a town hall event in 2011, and the proposal may have been what he was referring to when he said during his recent debate that he would "tweak" the program much as Ronald Reagan did in his grand compromise with house Democrats in 1983.
                Then there is his admission that he's purposely "a blank screen"for people to project their own ideals upon:
                Obama’s famous remark in the preface of the second of his two autobiographies: “I serve as a blank screen on which people of vastly different political stripes project their own views.”
                Or here:
                Here is yet one more opportunity for frustrated left and liberal Obama supporters/ex-supporters to consider the early and ominous wisdom of the eminent left political scientist Adolph Reed Jr.’s take on an unnamed Obama at the beginning of the future president’s political career in early 1996:
                “In Chicago, for instance, we’ve gotten a foretaste of the new breed of foundation-hatched black communitarian voices: one of them, a smooth Harvard lawyer with impeccable credentials and vacuous to repressive neoliberal politics, has won a state senate seat on a base mainly in the liberal foundation and development worlds. His fundamentally bootstrap line was softened by a patina of the rhetoric of authentic community, talk about meeting in kitchens, small-scale solutions to social problems, and the predictable elevation of process over program – the point where identity politics converges with old-fashioned middle class reform in favoring form over substances.  I suspect that his ilk is the wave of the future in U.S. black politics here, as in Haiti and wherever the International Monetary Fund has sway.”7
                Ten years later, Ken Silverstein’s fall 2006 Harpers’ essay, “Obama, Inc.” included the following notable passage:
                “It’s not always clear what Obama’s financial backers want, but it seems safe to conclude that his campaign contributors are not interested merely in clean government and political reform…On condition of anonymity, one Washington lobbyist I spoke with was willing to point out the obvious: that big donors would not be helping out Obama if they didn’t see him as a ‘player.’ The lobbyist added: ‘What’s the dollar value of a starry-eyed idealist?’” 8
                It wasn’t for nothing that Obama set new Wall Street and corporate fundraising records in the last presidential election cycle.
                So, that goes back a few years.  Hope it helps.  There's plenty of good reading at all those links. And, as suggested by others, Google is full of Barack Obama Agrees with Romney on Social Security, Reform Social Security, Tweak Social Security, etc.

                "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

                by YucatanMan on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 02:06:18 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  How's your HTML? (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  YucatanMan

                  Your browser probably has a "View source" option on it, with the coding intact.

                  If I were you, I'd open your comment (saved you the trouble here's it's link: http://www.dailykos.com/...)

                  then I'd view source, do a search in that file for "Here you go," which will bring you down to about where the comment starts (a little coding before it)

                  then I'd copy that through the ending paragraph...

                  and then go to my home-page and click "diaries > new"

                  and paste what you have here and publish as a Diary.

                  All the View Source/cut/paste would save you having to reformat from the beginning.

                  This ultimate refutation of the "Obama doesn't really mean it" talking point is worth a diary, and is wasted here, imo.

                  Of course, I'm always ready to volunteer that someone else do more work, so I'll not be offended if you say "piss off, clown."


                  If Republicans said every 3rd person named "Smith" should hang, we'd bargain them to every 7th. Then we'll see apologia written praising this most pragmatic compromise. There's our losing formula.

                  by Jim P on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 03:21:06 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Thanks for the tip and the help. (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Jim P

                    I think I did it OK, here.

                    "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

                    by YucatanMan on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 07:18:25 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  TnR'd. Hope it gets views. At the least, a handy (1+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      YucatanMan

                      resource for future comments when that nonsense shows up again.


                      If Republicans said every 3rd person named "Smith" should hang, we'd bargain them to every 7th. Then we'll see apologia written praising this most pragmatic compromise. There's our losing formula.

                      by Jim P on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 07:48:04 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

        •  If you want a more accurate measure for CPI (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Dallasdoc, peregrine kate, denise b, mik

          are you lobbying the White House and your legislators for the much more accurate CPI-E (E for "elderly") which acounts for the higher expenses for housing and medical care experienced  by the majority of Social Security recipients?

          Organ donors save lives! A donor's kidney gave me my life back on 02/18/11; he lives on in me. Please talk with your family about your wish to donate.

          Why are war casualty counts "American troops" and "others" but never "human beings"?

          by Kitsap River on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 02:16:15 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  yes, in fact (0+ / 0-)

            as I made clear in my comment, I favor honest accounting and valid predictive statistics over demonstrably inaccurate ones.  CPI-E obviously matches real costs to actual SS beneficiaries far better than the current CPI-W basis, at least by absolute measures.  I have no idea if they diverge or if they grow and shrink by similar factors, however.  From what I can tell, Chained CPI is an attempt to deal with non-linear effects of inflation.

            My point is that if CCPI (or, better yet, a CCPI-E) fits the shape of inflation better, inequities resulting from switching the methodology can be remedied by changing the multiplier for SS computation.

            Water which is too pure has no fish -- Ts'ai Ken T'an

            by mik on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 11:37:21 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  Obama follows a fairly well documented pattern of (6+ / 0-)

        legislative/academic types in executive office. The easy, simple—and not entirely accurate—excuse is they dither themselves to death with a personality tuned to "go along to get along" (legislative) and so deep in all the possible weeds of knowledge (academic) that they cannot cut through and make a necessary, quick decision. Obama's entire adult experience has been in "negotiation" without the necessary tempering of exercise of power. This seems to particularly show when he is "negotiating with himself" in the face of a hostile legislature.

        All that was my main reservation about Obama and he has pretty well followed my reservations there. There is something to be said for those with real executive experience, military or other, for the office of Chief Executive—and I'm not including Romneyesque rich boy with contacts as an "executive" either.

        The only foes that threaten America are the enemies at home, and those are ignorance, superstition, and incompetence. [Elbert Hubbard]

        by pelagicray on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:15:51 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  My main reservation is that he is a neo-lib (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          zinger99

          ....and he has pretty well followed my reservations there.

          •  Yeah, same, but I've been a bit surprised at some (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            starduster, zinger99

            of his economic tilt and particularly the reluctance to really go after some aggressive regulation after the baby went out with the bathwater during deregulation mania.

            I can somewhat understand the "too big to prosecute" thing as there really is a practical issue there and the law is weak in being able to single out individuals from behind corporate veils. Still, a few well butchered examples, some carcasses rotting in chains, might put some check on these modern pirates.

            The only foes that threaten America are the enemies at home, and those are ignorance, superstition, and incompetence. [Elbert Hubbard]

            by pelagicray on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 02:02:02 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

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