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View Diary: Did you hear the one about the 4yo who shot the deputy's wife? But he did not shoot the deputy. (285 comments)

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  •  Since guns will almost assuredly always be legal (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Norm in Chicago, happy camper

    There's no way that the law can really address this. It's unfortunate, but a reality of life. Jesus Loves You.

    by DAISHI on Mon Apr 08, 2013 at 11:39:35 PM PDT

    •  Do you really think the butchers bill (8+ / 0-)

      will never get too high, DAISHI? Do you really think we are as debased a people as that?

      I can't think that way. It might be easier if I could, but I can't.

      Peace is never simply the absence of war, it is the active presence of justice. It has to do with human fulfillment, with liberation, with wholeness, with a meaningful life and well-being, not only for the individual, but for the community as a whole.

      by left rev on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 05:13:51 AM PDT

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      •  Yes. (6+ / 0-)

        Heck we are a people that can support screwing over the other "guy" because we can't imagine ever being in their situation - see Medicaid/Medicare/SSN cuts; see blocks to Universal healthcare; see educational cuts; see cuts to welfare programs; see cuts to any anti-poverty program.  We are constantly battling and defending programs that are designed to keep people from impoverishment.  And it is all so we don't have a dime more in taxes - except we do but that money "rightfully" goes to our "job creator" overlords.

        A recent local event brings it home.  Our community fiercely resisted a property tax increase of maybe $50 a year on average and demanded/supported attacks on teachers and a nasty contract negotiation (this in one of the top SDs in the State and nation.  But recently the District decided to do away with a township tennis court that had been put on school property - the township stopped maintaining it years ago and the school needed additional parking and didn't want to pay for upkeep of a township responsibility.  Uproar and indignation ensued.  Meanwhile I strongly resisted the urge to tell them all - you get what you demand, just not always in the form you desire.

        "You have attributed conditions to villainy that simply result from stupidity"

        by newfie on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 06:12:25 AM PDT

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    •  Then why have any laws or penalties for breaking (13+ / 0-)

      laws?  This is why.  We've cut down on DUIs by a combination of education and severe penalties for driving while impaired by alcohol.  If you've got kids teenage or older, you know they've attended some kind of class or mock accident that gets across to them the real life impacts of driving under the influence.

      The same can be done with guns, although it will be more difficult and take a longer time.

    •  Here (14+ / 0-)

      Put the guy in jail for numerous crimes.  If drinking and driving a car or a boat is a crime, then drinking in the presence of loaded firearms should be a crime.  

      Endangerment of a child.  That guy should have to pay for the child's ongoing therapy.  The kid is never going to be able to live a normal life.  It's going to be haunting.  He's going to need ongoing mental care from the time he's old enough to realize what he did.  Someone has to be there to constantly remind him that it's not his fault.  (Robin Williams is expensive.)

      If the four year old had run her over with a car, the family would be getting financial relief.  But because she was shot, there will be none, unless there is some lawsuit from one part of the family against another part of the family.  

      I really don't like the hopelessness that is carried in the tone of these comments.  

      There are absolutely things that can be cone to deter this kind of shit, and to act like there isn't is simply mollycoddling a multimillion dollar industry.


      by otto on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 05:53:52 AM PDT

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      •  that's 100% right (8+ / 0-)

        This accidental homicide stuff is BS.
        If someone buy a gun and shoot some one (or the toddler shoots someone), should be life in prison.
        It's not an accident. Because the person bought a risky thing that is used to kill people.

        Obama 2012...going to win it with our support!!!

        by mattinjersey on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 06:47:16 AM PDT

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        •  No shit (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Damnit Janet, jan4insight

          This reminds me of that Dan Akroyd Skit on SNL when he has all the dangerous halloween costumes.  If you bought your kid the "Johnny Invisible Pedestrian" costume, you'd be held liable, in addition to the company that sold that fine reflection of the first amendment.  


          by otto on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 08:49:40 AM PDT

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      •  That 4-year-old will be fine. (0+ / 0-)

        Kids are resilient, and at 4, you're not even likely to know what exactly happened... just something bad. In addition, the person who got shot might have been a relative, but wasn't "his mom", so there won't be a daily reminder. Plus, nobody is going to blame him as he gets older, or shun him, etc. He won't even really remember this clearly after a short while.

        Who won't be fine is everyone else affected by this. They're the ones who'll need therapy.

        Freedom isn't free. So quit whining and pay your taxes.

        by walk2live on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 08:43:45 AM PDT

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        •  Not likely that you're correct (9+ / 0-)

          Everyone who ever comes to know him through his family will know about it.  He'll know about it.  He'll have to face it as a human being.  

          It's not a direct memory that causes the main issues, but I'm sure you've got plenty of memories from when you were that old, and I am going to be that such a traumatic and chaotic event as this must have been, it's not going to be easy to forget.  



          by otto on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 08:51:25 AM PDT

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          •  he'll know about it, for sure... (0+ / 0-)

            but it won't likely be a trauma for him... rather just one of those things. Nobody is going to blame him, and he likely won't remember the details first-hand. Most people can remember very little about what happened when they were 4, even very tragic events, and those memories are hazy.

            If he'd shot his mother or immediate family member, their absence would be felt, and would affect the boy in different ways.

            Anyway, I'm not trying to excust anyone, or claim that everything will be just fine. I just think people don't realize how well very small kids are at coping with tragedies like this. In a sense, their ignorance is bliss.

            Freedom isn't free. So quit whining and pay your taxes.

            by walk2live on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 03:53:10 PM PDT

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        •  Kids are resilient (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          milton333, otto

          when they see or experience trauma, provided they have supportive stable adults around them.  But they are not so resilient when they are the authors of something like this.  The kid's problem won't be PTSD, it will be the knowledge that he killed someone.

          “If the misery of the poor be caused not by the laws of nature, but by our institutions, great is our sin.” Charles Darwin

          by ivorybill on Tue Apr 09, 2013 at 02:30:50 PM PDT

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          •  SOME kids are resilient (0+ / 0-)

            There are questions about what causes kids to be resilient.  

            It's amazing to me that someone would say a four year old who shot and killed a family member won't end up with long term problems.  Astounding.


            by otto on Wed Apr 10, 2013 at 06:46:25 AM PDT

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