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View Diary: I Told You So: Now, Can We Finally Rise Up? (71 comments)

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  •  We ARE acting. Just read the internet. (0+ / 0-)

    Boehner Just Wants Wife To Listen, Not Come Up With Alternative Debt-Reduction Ideas

    by dov12348 on Wed Apr 10, 2013 at 12:09:10 PM PDT

    •  Sorry, but so far what I see is "reaction." Yes, (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Shockwave, Words In Action, jayden

      it needs to happen, and I'm all for it, but the movement needs to coalesce into an ongoing cohesive and strategic operation that's capable of acting in concert, that plans, that thinks ahead.

      I haven't seen that, yet.

      •  There is a logical order. (0+ / 0-)

        The reaction - which may be very rational; that needs to happen first.  Let this part go on and settle.  Then the organizing and other things can follow.  Else all is chaos.

        Boehner Just Wants Wife To Listen, Not Come Up With Alternative Debt-Reduction Ideas

        by dov12348 on Wed Apr 10, 2013 at 12:25:32 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I don't see any organizing. (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Ray Pensador, Words In Action

          I don't see any consensus-building, outside our little community here (and even then, sometimes it's damned hard to see).  I don't see any policy-making.  In fact, policy diaries usually end up in the distbin of the practically-never-read.  I don't see any real collective action starting.  Mostly what I see on this site, particularly on the rec list, is reaction. "Here's the awful thing the Republicans did today!  There's the awful thing some corporation did yesterday!"  But no action, long-term, is ever brought into focus.  This isn't action; Ray has a point.

          The road to Hell is paved with pragmatism.

          by TheOrchid on Wed Apr 10, 2013 at 12:47:43 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Exactly! That's exactly what I see (for the most) (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Words In Action, TheOrchid

            part.

          •  That's because it's too early for the... (0+ / 0-)

            ...large actions.

            These debates are not just emotional irrational yelling.  There is very serious rational debate going on.

            If you and Ray and others get the basics and are ready to go with that, fine.  But for the most part people should understand this at deeper levels and be intellectually prepared first and that is exactly what's happening.  That and only that will lead to large scale, organized, peaceful actions.

            Do you guys want this to be like 1968?

            Boehner Just Wants Wife To Listen, Not Come Up With Alternative Debt-Reduction Ideas

            by dov12348 on Wed Apr 10, 2013 at 01:01:50 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Otherwise you get most people out there... (0+ / 0-)

            ...who wouldn't have a clue about chained CPI, which they should understand.  

            Otherwise you end up with a large percentage of protesters not even knowing why they're there - like with the Occupy movement.  That's why Occupy petered out. Lots of emotion, which is the fire but the intellectual fuel was missing.

            Boehner Just Wants Wife To Listen, Not Come Up With Alternative Debt-Reduction Ideas

            by dov12348 on Wed Apr 10, 2013 at 01:10:55 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  That's simply false about OWS (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Ray Pensador

              Most people I talked to at OWS in Portland, Oregon, were far more informed than average. Many were highly informed activists. Many were highly educated. Many were students. Some were teachers or professors. Lots of them were highly motivated, experienced and aware union members. And many were much more savvy about politics than some of the DKos habitues'.

              There was plenty of intellectual fuel.

              My god, what elitist bull-crap.

              "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

              by ZhenRen on Wed Apr 10, 2013 at 01:42:11 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Well, Portland Oregon... (0+ / 0-)

                ...has a high intellectual content.  So perhaps it's an outlier.

                I'm referring to a great number of things I read.

                Boehner Just Wants Wife To Listen, Not Come Up With Alternative Debt-Reduction Ideas

                by dov12348 on Wed Apr 10, 2013 at 01:49:17 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  I've read a great number of things (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Ray Pensador

                  about OWS, and most of it has been completely inaccurate.

                  Give me a few links.

                  Most OWS core participants are above average in political knowledge. New York would have been as much or even more influenced by knowledgeable core participants than Portland.

                  "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                  by ZhenRen on Wed Apr 10, 2013 at 01:58:26 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I don't have links right now. (0+ / 0-)

                    That was my general impression.

                    Must be difficult now, where people should ideally try and understand chained CPI.

                    Boehner Just Wants Wife To Listen, Not Come Up With Alternative Debt-Reduction Ideas

                    by dov12348 on Wed Apr 10, 2013 at 02:17:54 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

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