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View Diary: No, cutting Social Security won't make young people love Democrats (119 comments)

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  •  Why do you advocate turning a retirement program (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    midwesterner, vigilant meerkat

    into a welfare program?

    And oh, by the way, there is no shortfall.

    •  Scrapping the cap does the same thing. (0+ / 0-)

      It makes the program more redistrubitive and less of a earned benefit program, because upper incomes won't take out in direct proportion to what they put in when we do away with the cap. So it's a moot point in this context. However, the answer to the question is because I'm a progressive and I don't think there's anything wrong with redistributive programs.

      Passive renunciation is not the whole of wisdom.

      by play jurist on Thu Apr 18, 2013 at 02:10:27 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Let me get this straight... (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        vigilant meerkat

        by achieving something closer to parity by removing the cap, and having upper income people pay a tiny percentage of their income in payroll taxes or in self employment taxes...this is somehow income redistribution, instead of a balance of the rich getting more free money, which they were able to garner by the generous tax cuts for the rich.

        All retirement programs are a roll of the dice.  My husband died before he could collect a dime of social security, yet for every person who dies before they can get their lousy grand or so a month, there will be wealthy person who will collect the maximum benefit (currently $2,513. a month) dine out pretty well on that extra cash.  

        The point of social security isn't getting all your money back or redistributing insurance isn't about getting all your money back in medical care, either.  Nor is car insurance.  

        •  It's redistrubution, (0+ / 0-)

          if some pay in more than they take out. That's a pretty simple concept. If you lift the cap on payroll taxes but not the cap on benefits, it will become a more redistributive system. Don't get me wrong. As I said I have no problem with redistribution or welfare. My point was just that I don't see how that's a criticism of means testing but not of lifting the cap. Both are redistributive in effect. With means testing, upper income boomers take the hit for the boomer demographics. With lifting the cap, mainly younger earners take the hit. So the real issue between these two plans is generational. My problem is with people trying to paper over the fact that there really is a generational issue here. Someone or another will have to pay more or get less to balance the books. I prefer it to be boomers, because I feel that my cohort is getting screwed on a whole lot of other stuff already.

          Passive renunciation is not the whole of wisdom.

          by play jurist on Fri Apr 19, 2013 at 04:31:56 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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