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View Diary: Brown administration official claims 'Delta can't be saved' (104 comments)

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  •  Central Valley agri-business, YES. (20+ / 0-)

    SoCA, not so much.
      So CA has become the spotted owl of the CA water wars.  Big Corp. agri-business wants No. CA voters to believe So CA is to blame for sucking up so much water from No. CA,  so they can divert attention away from the fact Central Valley agri-business are the ones siphoning off most of it before it ever gets to L.A. and nearby counties.

    My Karma just ran over your Dogma

    by FoundingFatherDAR on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 04:27:34 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  THIS!!!!!! (12+ / 0-)

      In NorCal it's easy to rile the public up against SoCal. Easy to get people pretending it's a ballgame and chanting "Beat L.A."  But the enemy isn't Los Angeles and isn't San Diego, the enemy is Bakersfield.

      "Great is the guilt of an unnecessary war" - John Adams

      by esquimaux on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 04:56:12 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  well NorCal v. SoCal is forever, whereas (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        mrsgoo, KenBee, GAS

        the Central Valley and the Sierras should be shared. I say this with approximately equal time spent in both halves and not enough in the rest (sic)

        Warning - some snark above‽ (-9.50; -7.03)‽ eState4Column5©2013 GOP Rep. Steve Stockman (TX):"If babies had guns, they wouldn't be aborted"

        by annieli on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 05:31:20 PM PDT

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        •  So glad to see you commenting here annieli! (7+ / 0-)

          The Public Trust Doctrine allows for reasonable and beneficial use of water as long as no damage occurs to the source.   Water rights are not water ownership. The public trust rests with the people. The water falls in the Sierras and flows to the ocean. Much like.... Anyway, the San Joaquin watershed has long been impounded and basically no outflow occurs. This comment could be a f'n diary. But if you want to start to understand WTF is going on - following Dan is a great start. Another great website to follow is http://mavensnotebook.com/ And if you get a chance to catch a viewing of Over Troubled Waters - It's a great intro movie about what's going on in the CA Delta. http://www.restorethedelta.org/...

          if a habitat is flooded, the improvement for target fishes increases by an infinite percentage...because a habitat suitability index that is even a tiny fraction of 1 is still infinitely higher than zero, which is the suitability of dry land to fishes.

          by mrsgoo on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 09:22:54 PM PDT

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          •  thanks, I've looked at water's political economy, (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            KenBee

            actually so I do understand the riparian issues, but I have only been casually interested in California water as a voter since the original Peripheral Canal conflict in the 1980s and more recently during the 1990s on water conservation in agribusiness. It's peripheral to some other renewables issues on the general history of US western land rights as well as renewable energy that I hope to get to once things get more settled (hah)

            Warning - some snark above‽ (-9.50; -7.03)‽ eState4Column5©2013 GOP Rep. Steve Stockman (TX):"If babies had guns, they wouldn't be aborted"

            by annieli on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 09:42:48 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Thank you mrsgoo. (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            mrsgoo, GAS

            You are one of the straightest shooters on this site, and among the very best informed on this issue.

            Wish I could thank you in person, but will have to do so indirectl6 via restorethedelta.org.

            •  Actually, I have to get credit to the mr.goo (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              GAS

              He's on water like I'm on politics. Thank You for supporting restorethedelta.org! When I really need an obscure water fact - he's my go to guy! When he needs names and bs on legislation - I'm his go to gal. And Rocky The Cat don't give a shit as long as his fud and water bowl are full!  

              if a habitat is flooded, the improvement for target fishes increases by an infinite percentage...because a habitat suitability index that is even a tiny fraction of 1 is still infinitely higher than zero, which is the suitability of dry land to fishes.

              by mrsgoo on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 12:13:39 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  mr.goo and mrs.goo both rock (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Creosote

                Mr.goo and mrs.goo are both great advocates for the Delta. Mrs.goo is one of the most relentless and vocal defenders of the Delta on websites ranging from the Sacramento Bee, to the San Jose Mercury News, to here at the dailkos. As Delta residents and business owners, they both understand the terrible consequences to salmon, Delta fish populations, family farmers, Delta businesses and the people of California if the peripheral tunnels are built.  

                •  Thanks Dan! That was awfully kind. Did you see (0+ / 0-)

                  the Sac Bee article on the Joint powers today? wow!

                  if a habitat is flooded, the improvement for target fishes increases by an infinite percentage...because a habitat suitability index that is even a tiny fraction of 1 is still infinitely higher than zero, which is the suitability of dry land to fishes.

                  by mrsgoo on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:02:35 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

              •  Well you both have my heartfelt thanks. (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                mrsgoo

                I can't see how anyone could sidestep your informed directness.

                Maybe it's time for the Pacific Northwest to get into the water exporting business rather than just running it into the storm drains. Or rather, it should be a national system, so that the pipelines make jobs and make sense!

                •  Thanks creosote! I have been thinking myself (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Creosote

                  lately that perhaps water needs to be viewed as a national rather than regional issue.

                  if a habitat is flooded, the improvement for target fishes increases by an infinite percentage...because a habitat suitability index that is even a tiny fraction of 1 is still infinitely higher than zero, which is the suitability of dry land to fishes.

                  by mrsgoo on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:05:20 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

          •  Thanks for this info. (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            mrsgoo, GAS
      •  Well, San Diego gets most of our water (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        mrsgoo, Heart of the Rockies

        from the Colorado River, AFAIK, which is sucked so dry the water doesn't even reach the gulf anymore. But that's in Mexico, so I guess that makes it politically easier to deal with.

        Gondwana has always been at war with Laurasia.

        by AaronInSanDiego on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 06:07:50 PM PDT

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      •  I cannot rec this comment enough! You got that so (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        annieli, Creosote

        fucking right!!! Now - keep preaching! We gotta break through the ballgame analogy!

        if a habitat is flooded, the improvement for target fishes increases by an infinite percentage...because a habitat suitability index that is even a tiny fraction of 1 is still infinitely higher than zero, which is the suitability of dry land to fishes.

        by mrsgoo on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 08:57:38 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  I'm not referring to the issue of this great (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        mrsgoo

        & important diary, but just the appearance of the phrase-

        the enemy is Bakersfield.
        made me spit out my coffee. As a Californio, it made me laugh with joy (again, not because of the issue discussed...just because....)

        America's greatest political dynasty...the Ka'an

        by catilinus on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 11:09:15 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  LOL! Way to late to be drinkin' coffee IMHO. But (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          catilinus, GAS, wu ming

          to each their own ;) I'm just glad you're here reading! And in reality the enemy isn't Bakersfield. The enemy is the SJ Valley corporate agri-businesses that think they should be at the head of the line for water. And they think they have the money and clout to do it. And so far, they have been winning. We gotta change that.

          if a habitat is flooded, the improvement for target fishes increases by an infinite percentage...because a habitat suitability index that is even a tiny fraction of 1 is still infinitely higher than zero, which is the suitability of dry land to fishes.

          by mrsgoo on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 11:19:58 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  YES!! The bastard behind this is Stewart Resnick (5+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      annieli, KenBee, Creosote, wu ming, NoMoreLies

      and his pomegranates and pistachios! They are Jr. water rights holders - that means you get SURPLUS water! No surplus - no water. They should be growing annual crops. Instead they planted trees and think that now they should be at the head of the fucking line for water. That is what this BDCP shit is all about. When Republicans in the Southern SJ Valley are holding FUNDRAISERS! for DiFi, you need to pay attention. As usual, it's all about the money! DiFi is NO friend of the bay and delta.

      if a habitat is flooded, the improvement for target fishes increases by an infinite percentage...because a habitat suitability index that is even a tiny fraction of 1 is still infinitely higher than zero, which is the suitability of dry land to fishes.

      by mrsgoo on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 08:56:05 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  and water for fracking...and in it's way worse (5+ / 0-)

      than the other so called 'reasons' for this diversions.

      This machine kills Fascists.

      by KenBee on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 10:08:38 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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