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View Diary: Historical Trends in Firearm Homicides, and Gunshot Injuries and Deaths 1981 – 2011 (39 comments)

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  •  Population Effects (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Glen The Plumber, LilithGardener

    If a growing US population is responsible for increases in both fatal and non-fatal gunshot injuries, and gun sales, we would expect the same growing US population to have a similar effect on bicycle injures and bicycle deaths.

    And as the data clearly shows, there is no upward trend in either fatal or non-fatal bicycle injuries.

    This is one reason why I included the data on bicycle injuries in the presentation.  Now in order to claim that a growing US population causes the observed increases in fatal and non-fatal gunshot injuries and gun sales, you are obliged to explain why there is not a similar effect on bicycle injuries.

    "The fool doth think he is wise: the wise man knows himself to be a fool" - W. Shakespeare

    by Hugh Jim Bissell on Thu May 09, 2013 at 11:37:41 AM PDT

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    •  Not so. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      MGross

      The growing population could be showing an upward trend that is being depressed downward because of bicycle helmet laws, making it appear as if there is no upward trend in the two bicycle injury columns.

      So you should still adjust it to be per capita.

      •  Except bicycle injuries involve not just heads (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        LilithGardener, Glen The Plumber

        1) Injuries to bicycle riders involve more than just the head; they involve all parts of the body.  Even with bicycle helmet laws, if a growing population causes increases in ALL kinds of injuries, including both gunshot injuries and bicycle injuries, we would normally expect increases in injuries to all parts of bicyclists, even if helmet laws reduce injuries to the head.

        2) Lots of gun owners now use eye protection while shooting.  We still see increases in gunshot injuries, despite the additional protection to eyes.  If this argument does not hold true for guns and eye protection, there is no reason we should expect the argument to hold true for bicycles and helmets.

        "The fool doth think he is wise: the wise man knows himself to be a fool" - W. Shakespeare

        by Hugh Jim Bissell on Thu May 09, 2013 at 03:12:40 PM PDT

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        •  Head injuries-->ER visit. Skinned knees? No. NT (0+ / 0-)
          •  No, skinned knees don't get treated at the ER (3+ / 0-)

            You are correct that skinned knees do not get treated at the ER (in the majority of cases).  But, broken ankles and legs DO get treated at the ER.  

            And bicycle helmets do not protect feet, ankles, legs, knees, hips, backs, elbows, wrists, arms shoulders, necks, or faces.

            Your argument is silly in the same way that saying the decrease in gun homicides is due to greater use of bullet-proof glass in city bodegas.

            "The fool doth think he is wise: the wise man knows himself to be a fool" - W. Shakespeare

            by Hugh Jim Bissell on Thu May 09, 2013 at 04:21:48 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Other confounding factors for bicycle accidents (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Glen The Plumber

              include increasing ridership as cities put in bike lanes.

              Does that increased ridership result in an increase in the number of injuries?

              Or a decrease in the number of injuries because if bike lanes are well designed riding a bicycle should be safer.

              Choosing helmets is arbitrary and pointless, unless it can be measured explicitly.

              "They did not succeed in taking away our voice" - Angelique Kidjo - Opening the Lightning In a Bottle concert at Radio City Music Hall in New York City - 2003

              by LilithGardener on Thu May 09, 2013 at 06:37:58 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

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