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View Diary: How to defuse the IRS-Tea Party Apology talking point -- in 3 Easy Steps (44 comments)

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  •  yes (7+ / 0-)

    and thus the Apology,

    for the specific targeting of groups

    with "Tea" or "Patriots" in their names.


    Singling those out, was wrong,

    and apparently confined to just the Cincinnati office, too

    (ie. What a far-reaching Election plot! )

    •  Gotta disagree there: IRS noticed a pattern, just (4+ / 0-)

      as they have with other groups, and investigated.  They should be doing more of this, not less. Anti-tax tax-dodging billionairre-money-laundering astroturf groups do not deserve a free pass, "conservative" or not.

      "Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob." -- Franklin D. Roosevelt

      by Kombema on Fri May 10, 2013 at 06:00:13 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  What pattern? N/T (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Victor Ward, VClib
        •  The whole reason they were targeted was likely a (0+ / 0-)

          pattern of lax filings and evidence behind their claims for tax-free status, which was likely duly investigated once it came to light. When they bitched about it, the administration likely panicked about seeming politically motivated, and got them to apologize -- despite legit original motivations.

          This is typical for this administration. They did the same thing relative to the DHS report on rightwing militia groups -- despite the fact that the report had originated in the Bush era DHS.

          "Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob." -- Franklin D. Roosevelt

          by Kombema on Fri May 10, 2013 at 09:27:38 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Wow, you should call the IRS (5+ / 0-)

            and let the commissioner know about your "likely" evidence!

            "That's absolutely inappropriate and not the way we should do things," Lerner said in a conference call with reporters.
            •  A WH-forced apology doesn't mean it didn't happen. (0+ / 0-)

              The WH panicked about being seen as partisan, and what was, based on what I know about the IRS and how it works (from friends who've worked there, among other things) likely a legit pattern, is being squelched because of politics.

              Do I know that for a fact? No, of course not. Just as anyone on this site has no idea what the real back story is. It's an educated guess, based on the circumstantial evidence. Prove otherwise.

              "Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob." -- Franklin D. Roosevelt

              by Kombema on Sat May 11, 2013 at 12:27:06 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Oh I got some facts (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Victor Ward

                A few things:

                One cannot disprove a negative. if you make a claim:

                The WH panicked about being seen as partisan, and what was, based on what I know about the IRS and how it works (from friends who've worked there, among other things) likely a legit pattern, is being squelched because of politics
                it is incumbent upon you to prove the accusation. It is not up to me to DISPROVE your claim. Show me your evidence.

                You should have stopped here:

                Do I know that for a fact? No, of course not.
                And
                It's an educated guess, based on the circumstantial evidence.
                Heck you don't even have 'circumstantial evidence"

                Here are the actual facts:

                Groups with tea party or Patriot in the name were targeted.

                This is blatantly illegal.

                it is even worse than the apology from the current commissioner.

                Senior Internal Revenue Service officials knew agents were targeting tea party groups as early as 2011, according to a draft of an inspector general's report obtained by The Associated Press that seemingly contradicts public statements by the IRS commissioner.
                because:
                “A federal watchdog’s upcoming report says senior Internal Revenue Service officials knew agents were targeting tea party groups in 2011. The disclosure contradicts public statements by former IRS Commissioner Douglas Shulman, who repeatedly assured Congress that conservative groups were not targeted. . . . The Treasury’s inspector general for tax administration is expected to release the results of a nearly yearlong investigation in the coming week. The Associated Press obtained part of the draft report.”
                So that’s why they released the story early — they knew it was coming out anyway.

                This is banana republic stuff. The government has to have trust for its agencies. Tax collectors targeting political enemies is absolutely unacceptable. To excuse this is to deny democracy. head should roll.

                •  Nope. Notice there's not evidence they were (0+ / 0-)

                  targeted BECAUSE they were political, but that they are political and were targeted -- likely because of a pattern of abuse and laundering of dark money through them. This is, by the way, since you clearly don't have any idea about these groups, a very common practice for Teabagger astroturf groups. The IRS was just doing its job, and Obama panicked. Now he's making the political firestorm worse by throwing the IRS under the bus.

                  "Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob." -- Franklin D. Roosevelt

                  by Kombema on Mon May 13, 2013 at 06:05:00 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                •  This is not helping. (0+ / 0-)

                  Reacting to the event and deamnding action be taken before we can come to a logical conclusion about what went on and what is needed to solve it fixes nothing.

                  Will this fix the problem that let the Bush IRS target and harass liberal groups? No. It may even make them think they can get away with it. Cause thats what it looks like from here.

                  The acting comissioner was fired, despite not being responsible. The comissioner at the time was a bush appointee. There was zero rightwing oturage at the harassment of liberal groups.

                  And now we're punishing our own people over things their people did. This solves nothing.

                  "Trust not the words of a poet, as he is born to seduce. Yet for poetry to seize the heart, it must ring with the chimes of truth."

                  by kamrom on Thu May 16, 2013 at 09:43:30 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

          •  Likely and likely? (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            hmi, Victor Ward, VClib, MetalGod65
            The whole reason they were targeted was likely a (0+ / 0-)
            pattern of lax filings and evidence behind their claims for tax-free status, which was likely duly investigated once it came to light.
            And I can say that you likely are a practitioner of gerbil stuffing.

            Certainly can't prove I'm wrong... after all, I'm just saying it's likely, not claiming you actually did it or that I have any evidence for the claim.

            Squirmy squirmy fun!

          •  Kombema - how could you possibly know? (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Victor Ward

            "let's talk about that"

            by VClib on Sat May 11, 2013 at 07:35:27 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  Evidence please... (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Adam B, Victor Ward, VClib
        IRS noticed a pattern, just (4+ / 0-)
        as they have with other groups, and investigated.
        Are you pulling this out of your ass?  Or do you have evidence for your claim?

        I suspect the former.

      •  Kombema - a pattern? How would you know? (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Victor Ward, MetalGod65

        "let's talk about that"

        by VClib on Sat May 11, 2013 at 07:38:19 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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