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View Diary: Bill Maher's excellent and sobering commentary on the wealth gap (121 comments)

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  •  No, the definition of lying is (0+ / 0-)
    Not telling the truth
    (from The Google).

    Intent is not (necessarily) relevant.

    •  Intent is exactly relevant (7+ / 0-)

      And intent is a part of "tell the truth", too--- it means to say what you believe to be true.

      There is a difference between not telling the truth and saying something that isn't true.  The latter includes both lying and just being wrong.  

      Conservatives need to realize that their Silent Moral Majority is neither silent, nor moral, nor a majority.

      by nominalize on Sat May 11, 2013 at 01:40:14 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Umm, no (0+ / 0-)

        Truth is defined as:

        Truth: The quality or state of being true
        Again, intent, belief, etc are not required parts of "truth"

        IOW, truth is a stand-alone, absolute concept.  Almost religious in nature I dare say . . . .

        •  So: NO DIFFERENCE between lying & being wrong? (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          JerryNA, niemann

          I am a leaf on the wind - i hover, twirl, float,
          Weightless, frictionless, I fly

          by chmood on Sun May 12, 2013 at 06:10:24 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Of course there is a difference (0+ / 0-)

            or why have two words?

            But, if one drew a Venn Diagram of the two things, there would be considerable overlap to be sure.

            •  a lie is a deception. it is not being incorrect. (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              chmood

              and the truth is that nobody actually knows the truth of anything beyond abstractions, so, nearly nothing we communicate is actually the truth

              there are two ways to 'know' truth, to the degree that it is knowable.  

              1) from first hand experience
              2) you accept what someone you trust says is the truth

              most of what people 'know' is second hand.  that is why trust is so important.  trust is required to accept a truth from another person.

              it's one thing to be wrong.  we are all wrong to some degree about just about everything in life.  which is why we generally accept a margin of error in life.  

              but it is quite another thing to deceive.  to lie.  to lie is to betray trust.  

              and much of lying is about taking advantage of that margin of error that people accept.  that's what happens in politics all the time.  they use that margin of error to say something that is just close enough to being true, but not true enough to be to their advantage.

              it's a betrayal.  getting a math question wrong on a test is being wrong.  lying is a betrayal of trust.  

              the difference between being wrong and lying is as great as the difference between having sex with someone you love and being raped.

        •  truth is one thing (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          chmood

          telling the truth is another.  And to tell the truth, there is intent to be factual to the best of your knowledge.

          Conservatives need to realize that their Silent Moral Majority is neither silent, nor moral, nor a majority.

          by nominalize on Sun May 12, 2013 at 05:34:37 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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