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View Diary: Climate change isn't AN issue, it's THE issue (214 comments)

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  •  The Biggest Issue (4+ / 0-)
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    orlbucfan, paradise50, DSPS owl, TomFromNJ

    IMO, climate change is not the biggest issue! It is only a huge aspect of the larger issue of population growth!

    •  They're interrelated. (5+ / 0-)

      I was moved by the final chapter in Alan Weisman's The World Without Us, where he makes a persuasive case that human survival becomes much easier to envision if our numbers dropped down to 1.6 billion by 2100, rather than increasing (as currently projected) to 9 million. Whether this happens by voluntarily curtailing births, by incentives that encourage curtailing births, or by increased deaths through starvation, drought, disease, and warfare, some sort of population crash seems inevitable. How it happens depends on human choices.

      That said, my experience is that many people (mostly affluent highly educated white males) who advocate "population control" rather than choice often end up advocating some pretty weird, top-down, authoritarian policies that I can't endorse. I don't have an easy answer to that dilemma, other than educating girls around the world (which demonstrably lowers birth rates), making birth control and early abortion cheap and available (but not mandatory), and dis-incentivizing the high-tech baby-making industry.

      •  And yet the idiot Pro-life group is ... (1+ / 0-)
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        targeting birth control now!

        I consider myself to not be pro-abortion, but when abortion and birth control are freely available the abortion rate goes down!  I'm into results, not punishment, which seems to drive the so-called "pro-life" group.

        At least women should have some choice in the matter!  Maybe then the population would at least stabilize!

      •  The resources exist (1+ / 0-)
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        land, water, for humanity to exist comfortably on Earth at double the current population. All it takes is an understanding that neoliberal economics is destroying the planet. Neoliberal economics demands that progress be measured. Our fault lies in how we measure progress. We measure it in the size of the economic pie. We need to forget about the size of the pie.

        Neoliberal economists have been feeding us a load of bull about resources and growing the pie. We need a neo-neoliberal view that the economic pie must be shared by the entire planet, not just a few wealthy nations. Once we understand that there won't be any limits to providing the entire Earth's population with the resources to live comfortably.

        The problem exists with the politicians telling us, especially in the US that "green" is equivalent with having to live a spartan lifestyle. We allow ourselves to be duped into believing this nonsense. Green means understanding that resources are finite and "deus ex machina" won't save us.

        We might have to establish colonies on the moon and Mars but once we do we will be able to use the resources there in a judicious manner.

        Knowledge is Power. Ignorance is not bliss, it is suffering.

        by harris stein on Sun May 19, 2013 at 11:51:43 AM PDT

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        •  I'm not sure you're considering the natural world (0+ / 0-)

          in these calculations. We do have to live in a spartan lifestyle. Too many people; too much consumption. When we've solved those issues, we can start to live big again.

          Science is a way of thinking much more than it is a body of knowledge. -Carl Sagan

          by howardfromUSA on Mon May 20, 2013 at 12:12:58 AM PDT

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    •  ...hope you comment more... (0+ / 0-)
      Welcome from the DK Partners & Mentors Team. If you have any questions about how to participate here, you can learn more at the Knowledge Base or from the New Diarists Resources Diaries. (Click on orange text to go to linked content.) Diaries labeled "Open Thread" are also great places to ask. We look forward to your contributions.

      Ignorance is bliss only for the ignorant. The rest of us must suffer the consequences.

      by paradise50 on Sun May 19, 2013 at 02:38:04 PM PDT

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    •  Not really. (0+ / 0-)

      The carbon footprint of most of the world is pretty low. The energy intensive high-polluting lifestyle of Americans and a few other countries is more significant.
      I think one of the barriers to effective action is that too much of the movement wants to view all issues through the same lens as they did 30 years ago. It's not helpful.

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