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View Diary: It has happened again: Three teens raped a 12 year old girl at gunpoint and post video on Facebook (194 comments)

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  •  RE: (33+ / 0-)
    They do in fact receive messages from the world around them that they can get by with it.
    It was three males against one female...and they still decided to pull a gun...because, you know:  Guns are noble.  Guns make you rightious.

    The NRA pushes a sick message.  Fuck them.  

    If you are smart enough to positively know the climate is not being affected by humans, then you are also smart enough to develop a fusion reactor which runs solely from water and air….so get your ass moving!

    by quiet in NC on Sat May 18, 2013 at 03:14:05 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  It's not just the gun part. (16+ / 0-)

      We see other cases without guns where this happens and that put it online. Maybe the gun gives them an extra jolt of testosterone but guns are not the direct cause here.

      •  That is hard to determine from the story... (9+ / 0-)

        as published, but what we do know is she went there to "talk", saw the gun and was raped.  It is quite possible without the gun she could have turned and ran.  We don't know.  But my point was they felt they could get away first with instigating the rape and then publishing it--something put that idea in their heads, and our culture golrifies guns on many levels.  Without the gun maybe the rape would not have happened and maybe they would not have felt like kings of the world.

        If you are smart enough to positively know the climate is not being affected by humans, then you are also smart enough to develop a fusion reactor which runs solely from water and air….so get your ass moving!

        by quiet in NC on Sat May 18, 2013 at 03:32:46 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I am about as strong an advocate (16+ / 0-)

          of gun control as you can get. It certainly could have added to this situation. The point I was trying to make is that we have a problem with a culture that enables rape with or without guns.

          •  I'm pretty sure we are on the same page... (6+ / 0-)

            just in different paragraphs.  My point is our culture takes guns and treats them like big, throbbing, succumb to me, dicks.  Hollywood does it, video games do it and the NRA preaches it.  

            That shit needs to stop.

            If you are smart enough to positively know the climate is not being affected by humans, then you are also smart enough to develop a fusion reactor which runs solely from water and air….so get your ass moving!

            by quiet in NC on Sat May 18, 2013 at 03:56:04 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  Ya can't outrun a bullet. (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          splashy, Treetrunk
          •  You can run 20 feet in a second and a half (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            exlrrp, Treetrunk, defluxion10

            At which point most people with handguns will miss you. It's a desperate move and thinking about it risks distracting us from the goal of preventing rape attempts in the first place, but is important to know that the innocent have options.

            Freedom isn't free. Patriots pay taxes.

            by Dogs are fuzzy on Sun May 19, 2013 at 12:31:04 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  And how likely is that to happen? (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              defluxion10

              The military talks about an OODA Loop: observe, orient, decide, and act.  A person has to make an effort to react when confronted with a threat.  With training you can react by running away when confronted by a gun.  But the average person won't have that training.

              The result is of the two people, both using an OODA loop, one will be a step or two behind the other.

              Bad guy observes the girl come in the room and orients the gun in his hand (but hidden), The girl comes in the room and observes the guy.  the guy decides "if she runs I'll shoot her, if she stands still, I'll rape her".  The girl orientates to the guy.  The guy acts by demanding she do what he tells her to do and pulls the gun.  Now the girl has to step back to observing the gun, orienting to it and make a decision and then act, but the guy has started acting and is three steps into the OODA loop again.  The girl is confused and trying to catch up to get away.  At some point humans "give up" and go along just to survive.

              Training lets you shift where you are in the OODA loop, to speed up your process and build in default actions like running away or gouging the eyes.  

              Stupid question hour starts now and ends in five minutes.

              by DrillSgtK on Sun May 19, 2013 at 05:54:39 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  FEAR= Fuck Everything And Run (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Treetrunk, defluxion10

                You don't need a lot of training to run from danger, its a natural reaction

                Happy just to be alive

                by exlrrp on Sun May 19, 2013 at 06:36:10 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Actually a natural reaction is to (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Treetrunk, defluxion10

                  Stand still and not move until the object of your fear moves.

                  Movement attracts predators, in many cases animals have a natural response to chase anything the runs even when it is not hunting.

                  Because of that, humans first natural response is to freeze.  We do that when we see a big dog walking towards us late a night alone.  We do that when a big BOOM goes off.  We do that when Jason jumps out of the shadows and yells "booga-booga".

                  Humans naturally freeze, go into the OODA loop and then act unless they have been trained.

                  I had the opportunity to see this in action one day.  We were on a call in the East Side of Cleveland. A medical issue that needed extra hands to help move the person out of their home.  After the first ambulance left, the rest of us were chatting with the Cleveland cop who came by. (not the nicest neighborhood)

                  Suddenly two houses away three shots rang out.  Of the five of us, three had military training/Police training.  The other two did not.  The cop turned towards the sound of the shots, drew is gun and moved behind cover while calling on the radio, all in less time that it took to read this.

                  Me and the other Paramedic who had military experience lowered our profile and took cover behind the trucks opposite of the shots, my buddy even reached for his rifle he did not have.  The other two turned towards the shots, cringed and looked around trying to process what to do.  After a few seconds they joined us behind the trucks.  By that point had the shots been intended for us, they would have made great targets.

                  (The shots were at a home from the back yard, and "no one saw anything".)

                  Stupid question hour starts now and ends in five minutes.

                  by DrillSgtK on Sun May 19, 2013 at 09:04:46 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

    •  I don't think these perps consume much (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      drmah, Texas Lefty, Kickemout, Samulayo

      NRA propaganda.  Do you?  

      _"Love is the rosebud of an hour; Friendship the everlasting flower."_ Brook Boothby

      by Keith930 on Sat May 18, 2013 at 06:13:18 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  The y do if you look at the entirety (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Treetrunk

        Of the culture, which has been heavily influenced by the NRA over the years.

        You really see it in the difference between things like TV shows produced here in the US compared to shows from other countries like Canada and Britain. Ones from the US go for the gun far faster than the ones from Canada and Britain, have bigger and longer firefights, and less actual diplomacy and communication.

        Women create the entire labor force. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sympathy is the strongest instinct in human nature. - Charles Darwin

        by splashy on Sat May 18, 2013 at 10:45:26 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  We need better firearm regulation in this (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Dogs are fuzzy

      country.

      That really hasn't got anything to do with this case.  

      "The thing about smart motherfuckers is that they sound like crazy motherfuckers to dumb motherfuckers." Robert Kirkman

      by JesseCW on Sun May 19, 2013 at 12:12:17 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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