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View Diary: Strength Lies in Organization: Building a Nationwide Network of Activists (18 comments)

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  •  Good luck (0+ / 0-)

    walking away from organized capital as though it doesn't exist in the US.  I can tell you right now that's not going to work.  At very best you'll get recouped into their service.  The other outcomes involve being blind-sided by entrenched power and interests.

    Hic Rhodus, hic salta!

    by ActivistGuy on Mon May 20, 2013 at 05:20:17 AM PDT

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    •  i just don't agree. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      we spend too much energy responding, refuting these thugs... just like the FP here... on and on and on about the insanity and it only gets worse.

      how do we suspend NDAA or stop foreclosures using the tools in local/state/regional gov'ts... who are our allies there and how can we get more sane/secular/service-minded people in positions to mitigate this mess?

      Ray is spot on. it's time to leave the gods and get some other mojo working.

      and then, once we find the tools, get some kind of motion in our direction, we should go after the crooks and make them accountable, under due process (the very things they are denying to many others) and put together legally gained evidence and throw them in jail and those we can't find the evidence on, we can certainly dishonor by exposing their misdeeds.

      accountability is key. Obama and brand/professional Democrats in Washington or around the country are useless and not part of the solution. we don't need more dems, but we do need to find better ones along with ethical Indies and Repubs et al for as fully a representational gov't as is possible.

      “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn’t do than by the ones you did do.” - Mark Twain

      by pfiore8 on Mon May 20, 2013 at 05:35:47 AM PDT

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      •  We hardly respond at all to the thugs (2+ / 0-)
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        Ray Pensador, pfiore8

        Sure, we talk about how they are bad and how we want them to stop, but we don't do anything about it. Certainly nothing effective. We have to do both. There are a lot of people working on what you're talking about, a whole lot. It certainly can't hurt to have more, but saying we have to ignore the big powers seems like an incredibly dangerous plan. What we have to do is hurt them. We need to do real economic damage to banks. And no one is planning that right now.

        If debt were a moral issue then, lacking morals, corporations could never be in debt.

        by AoT on Mon May 20, 2013 at 09:27:11 AM PDT

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        •  can you change the big powers? (0+ / 0-)

          can we change them? do you think speaking truth to power means anything? because here's the kicker: THEY DON'T GIVE A RAT'S ASS.

          it's not like suddenly they're going to have revelation and get on the climate bandwagon... unless it threatens them in a way they can't get around. but believe me when that happens, they'll throw the rest of us off the bus to save themselves.

          we need to stop wasting time on this immovable monolithic force and get millions and millions of people moving away from them and doing something outside of them... and i tell you this: they will come crumbling down.

          but the longer we wait, the longer we believe in some brand Democrat the longer we do not act on our behalf.

          “Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn’t do than by the ones you did do.” - Mark Twain

          by pfiore8 on Mon May 20, 2013 at 09:49:58 AM PDT

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          •  I didn't say we should speak to them (0+ / 0-)

            I said we should hurt them. They are not an immovable monolithic force. They are a powerful cartel. If we don't weaken them through various attacks then they will be able to take apart whatever we built as an alternative.

            I'm not calling for legislation or anything that involves the party, I'm talking about organizing. Talking about the party and speaking out ignores the power that we really have, the power of refusal. They think they have us in a bind.

            What you're talking about is half the answer, but we need to confront them as well.

            If debt were a moral issue then, lacking morals, corporations could never be in debt.

            by AoT on Mon May 20, 2013 at 10:03:23 AM PDT

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    •  You don't need to walk away from organized (2+ / 0-)
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      Ray Pensador, unfangus

      capital, you just need to rethink it.  For example, throw a dart-board at a map of the US and pick the closest town.  No matter where the dart lands, I bet that town does one thing in particular: drink beer.

      Figure out how much that town spends on beer and ask yourself: why are they drinking swill produced by an international corporation probably under foreign ownership where the profits are being siphoned off into Caribbean bank accounts?  How hard is it to set up a local brewery and redirect all beer purchases to locally made beer?  Now, they have increased local employment but everyone still has what they had: beer.  And brewing beer is not rocket science.

      You could create a list of commodities such as this: bread, wine, etc. (who is providing meals in the schools?  Is it an international corporation?  Why?).

      It could be as simple as asking people why they (as communities) are paying other people to do what they should be doing themselves, and instilling a little pride in local workmanship.

      This is of-course, the exact opposite of the contempt-for-community and outsourcing that is sweeping the nation.

      Go figure...

      To any wingnut: If you pay my taxes I'll give you a job.

      by ban48 on Mon May 20, 2013 at 06:49:18 AM PDT

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