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View Diary: It's not personal, it's just business (127 comments)

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  •  Keep in mind that all rich people (27+ / 0-)

    who own huge yachts are not Republicans. Some are liberal Democrats who just happen to be rich. The problem is really with just the subset of rich people who prioritize their tax rates over the good of the country. A surprising number of rich people do not like what is happening and would prefer to pay more in taxes in order to balance the scales. They give a lot of money to Obama and other Dems and good progressive causes, but they can't control a GOP Congress. Every $25,000-a-plate fundraiser that Obama goes to (and he goes to a lot) is full of people telling him that they want to pay higher taxes.

    •  Fair point (25+ / 0-)

      It takes real integrity and strength of character to knowingly advocate for policies that will cost you an arm and a leg to help the less fortunate.

      •  More like an arm OR a leg...maybe (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        greenearth, ladybug53, JerryNA, nchristine

        The top 1% of households had minimum income of $516,633 in 2010, down from $646,195 in pre-crash 2007. They lost more from the various asset bubbles bursting than from any additional tax or regulatory burden which might ever be imposed on them.

        Who are the 1 percent?

        When you are right you cannot be too radical; when you are wrong, you cannot be too conservative. --Martin Luther King Jr.

        by Egalitare on Sun Jun 16, 2013 at 06:01:37 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  You're comment says it all. So many good kossacks (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        rail against the evils of the wealthy (and for very good reason, I do to), because the rich just don't want to pay more taxes to the Govt to "pay for" all the things that are necessary for the Govt to do to help us make a better society.  But thats the rub, the wealthy have perpetuated The Big Lie since Nixon and his commerce secretary Pete Peterson (yes, that pete peterson of Fix the Debt fame),  took the USA off the gold standard on August 15, 1971.  The Big Lie is that the Govt must get tax money or borrow before it can spend money just like our personal household or business budgets.  The USA runs a fiat monetary system and uses a non-convertible, floating exchange rate national currency.  The US dollar comes from the US govt.  If you think that the Govt can't "afford" to pay for SS or medicare for all unless it first raises the taxes on the wealthy, then you are part of the problem.  Americans will never ever accept tax collections as high as 30 - 40% of GDP to "pay for" a social democracy with a better safety net, and they don't have to.  The federal Govt has no need of our money, it does not work in any way like a regular budget.  The Govt is the currency issuer and we don't need to tie new social spending to higher taxes, that argument is a political loser and the reason for The Big Lie in the first place.  As long as people believe that the Federal Govt must "earn money" instead of simply create more of its own money (like it does for every deficit dollar), than the rich right wingers are going to keep winning.

        "The Earth is my country and Science my religion" Christiaan Huygens.................... Please join our Kos group "Money and Public Purpose". The gold standard ended on August 15, 1971, its time we start acting like it.

        by Auburn Parks on Mon Jun 17, 2013 at 06:00:02 AM PDT

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    •  speculation (5+ / 0-)

      what do you really know about very rich people? If you're one yourself then good for you, but other than possibly the exception of yourself, you're going to have to do better than just say "Some are liberal Democrats who just happen to be rich".

      Can you assure that " Democrats who just happen to be rich" pay taxes without illegally (and/or loophole-ly) hide money offshore.

      There's a tendency among many commenters to simply assert things to support points of view, with absolutely no attention paid to the veracity or ability to establish as fact.


      Every $25,000-a-plate fundraiser that Obama goes to (and he goes to a lot) is full of people telling him that they want to pay higher taxes.
      - do you have evidence of that? Please quote respectable references
    •  And it doesn't sound like the merely rich are (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      greenearth, mkor7, ladybug53

      doing so splendidly either.

      and less price slashing on pre-owned boats of this caliber, industry specialists say.
      That means there is still plenty of price slashing going on, just that the cut that finally sells is slightly less bloody...

      "They did not succeed in taking away our voice" - Angelique Kidjo - Opening the Lightning In a Bottle concert at Radio City Music Hall in New York City - 2003

      by LilithGardener on Sun Jun 16, 2013 at 05:48:37 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Regarding your statement: (10+ / 0-)

      "....A surprising number of rich people do not like what is happening and would prefer to pay more in taxes in order to balance the scales...."

      I am reminded that in the discussion of the Mittster's tax obligations it was pointed out that there are legal provisions for donating more than one's tax obligation to the US.  Of  course I am also conscious of the revelation (for me, at least) in the book "Perfectly Legal" that Bill Gates made a profit on his massive donation to his foundation, thanks to tax law.

      I don't think going to $25,000 dinners to move a preferred person into office quite satisfies my new motto:  "torches and pitchforks."  For a while I added "and guillotines" but friends said that was to violent.

    •  Also the lower middle class is now poor (20+ / 0-)

      So yes there are some super rich people that are consuming the major amount of resources and through policies causing massive redirection of income.  On the other hand, over the past twenty years all the affordable housing in my area has been destroyed.  The poor are forced to move the segregated areas within the cities, where resources are not available, or the suburbs where is it much harder to be poor.  Most of the free cultural and educational opportunities  have disappeared, and those that are left have become so scarce to be unavailable to most.

      In the city with affordable housing it is not impossible to be lower middle class.  We had a car, but it never had to go more than five miles to get everywhere we needed to go.  I could walk or ride my bike or the bus everywhere, even if meant I sometimes had to walk a few miles.  I never needed to have much money in my pocket.  I never needed a car until I had a job that support a monthly payment.

      My concern with kids today is that they lack free opportunities to do stuff.  They lack safety outside.  On my street SUVs are parked all over the road so no one can see, and SUVs drive at great speed down the narrow roads with no care of who they are going to hit, polluting the air.  Kids are told they need junk food and cell phones and video games to be happy.  Where are their opportunities to just go outside and experience the world, take a bus downtown, walk to a library.  To me it is not so much that the middle class is necessarily shrinking, but it that the expectations are increasing so much, and the things that used to funded by taxes are now pay for play, that those of us who would one be considered lower middle class are now poor.

      Jobs that once had insurance do not.  Jobs that once had paid sick days do not.  Free vaccinations are no more.  Even parks are becoming private clubs.

    •  Just happen to be rich. (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      raboof, ladybug53, RiveroftheWest

      Man, can you believe it?

      I was out jogging in the park, feeling good about myself.
      It was a beautiful day. Sun was up.  People running the other way smiled and said "Hello!"

      When I was done with my run, I ambled over to the juice bar to score me a smoothie, when, suddenly, somebody leapt up to open the door.

      As I entered the place, 4 employees threw themselves on the floor and insisted that I walk to the counter over their prostrate bodies so as to avoid indignities to the soles of my shoes.

      Guy at the counter had my smoothie made before I even got there, and served it to me with his head bowed, refusing to make eye contact.

      I went back to my car, and, to my surprise, my trusty and rusty old Geo Prizm was gone, replaced by a Tungsten Silver Aston Martin DB9.

      Whaddya know?

      Somewhere between mile 2 and the juice bar, I had become filthy stinking rich.

      Go figure.

      LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

      by dinotrac on Mon Jun 17, 2013 at 02:47:59 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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