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View Diary: Thousands of companies swap data with the NSA (247 comments)

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  •  why? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Rich in PA, zed

    You act like like the US government has some crack super secret team of ninja squirrels that will disappear you

    Gods I am so tired of people acting like we are living in a police state

    In the time that I have been given,
    I am what I am

    by duhban on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 04:43:55 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  AKA: 'Whistling past the graveyard' or (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      gjohnsit, Dianna, YucatanMan

      'Re-arranging deck chairs on the Titanic' (as it heads toward the 'iceberg' Loretta Sanchez mentioned yesterday).

      •  um no (0+ / 0-)

        I just think people are overreacting

        In the time that I have been given,
        I am what I am

        by duhban on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 01:31:07 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  It cuts both ways, I think. On other Democratic- (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          YucatanMan

          leaning boards there is a strong contingent calling for Greenwald to be prosecuted, under some bizarre theory where the First Amendment I guess simply ceases to exist. They've already eviscerated the Fourth, might as well make room for the First, I suppose that thinking goes.

          As soon as Loretta Sanchez issued her not-so sub rosa invitation to other whistleblowers and investigative journalists yesterday to reveal more of the 'iceberg,' I figured this could become, if not a government-ending scandal, then certainly a party-killing issue, before it's all over.

          We shall see.

          •  wow (0+ / 0-)

            so you are one of those then? I love dealing with the green party so full of idealism and yet so far from reality

            In the time that I have been given,
            I am what I am

            by duhban on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 03:50:34 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Hunh? One of what? Are you red-baiting (or, in (0+ / 0-)

              this case, green-baiting)? I'm a registered Dem and voted Dem from 1980 through 2008. I voted Peace and Freedom in 2012 to protest the non-closure of Guantanamo and other issues where I felt like Obama had failed to deliver.

              Now it appears I may have been merely the proverbial canary in a coal mine of noxious Democratic fumes.

              But, as I said, we shall see.

              •  you are the one rooting for the dem party to fall (0+ / 0-)

                not me

                In the time that I have been given,
                I am what I am

                by duhban on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 05:24:54 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  I'm rooting for the entire capitalist-imperialist (0+ / 0-)

                  system to fail, including both major bourgeois parties. I suppose I subscribe to the romantic Marxian notion of 'historical inevitability' for said failure, while trying in the meantime to ameliorate as many of the cruelties of capitalism as I can and stand resolutely against its manifest brutality.

                  But I also adhere strictly to a belief in 'one person, one vote' and try to hew adamantly to a policy of non-violence in both my personal and my poltiical lives.

                  Here's an interesting thought experiment for you to try: if we were to take the entire U.S. national income and divide it equally, each American family of four would receive approximately $200,000/year. In the abstract, doesn't that strike you as a far more equitable, hence moral, distribution of wealth than the current landscape of suffering and misery?

                  •  and I don't (0+ / 0-)

                    I think Marx at best saw the problems of a 100 years ago but the problems of a 100 years ago are not inherently the probelms we face today. That said I think him a fool for thinking captialism will fail because frankly while it's not perfect it's been implemented far better then Marx's ideas.

                    I think strict equality is great in theory but so long as we are dealing with the fundamental forces that drive captialism (want and scarcity) that's not going to happen.

                    I would love to have some Roddenberry Utopia but for now the reality is that's not happening and so we are left doing what we can with what we have. It really sucks sometimes but then that's life.

                    In the time that I have been given,
                    I am what I am

                    by duhban on Sat Jun 15, 2013 at 01:23:06 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

    •  You don't have very good vision, do you? (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      cardboardurinal, YucatanMan
      Just last month, unilateral changes to US military laws formally granted the Pentagon extraordinary powers to intervene in a domestic “emergency” or “civil disturbance”:

      “Federal military commanders have the authority, in extraordinary emergency circumstances where prior authorization by the President is impossible and duly constituted local authorities are unable to control the situation, to engage temporarily in activities that are necessary to quell large-scale, unexpected civil disturbances.”

      Other documents show that the “extraordinary emergencies” the Pentagon is worried about include a range of environmental and related disasters.

      http://www.rawstory.com/...
    •  round up the usual suspects (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      gjohnsit, Dianna, YucatanMan

      to say it's all nothing, we're just crazy nutcases for not trusting the govt and for worrying about our civil liberties.

      "Watch what you say or they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, fanatical, criminal..."-7.75, -5.54

      by solesse413 on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 10:52:18 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Yeah. They seem to be everywhere (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      gjohnsit, YucatanMan

      these days, acting like good little automatons as they go about their daily business of providing the gub'mint SuperSpies with stuff to giggle at and share with each other through their in-bunker intranets, never complaining about the loss of liberties they never used anyway and didn't know they had in the first place, feeling all toasty safe from da ebil terrier-ists and assorted less-than white folks forever plotting to trouble their hypnotic stupor and drug-induced apathy with uncomfortable truths their bureaucratic overlords don't want them to know.

      ...for their own good, of course.

      •  we have always existed in a delicate balance (0+ / 0-)

        of rights vs limitations. If you want to get off your cross for a bit I wouldn't mind having an actual conversation about that in the digital age because it is a conversation we all as a nation need to have.

        But I am not impressed by overreaction and hyperbole

        In the time that I have been given,
        I am what I am

        by duhban on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 01:34:36 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  What, pray tell, (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          AoT, gjohnsit

          would make you think I am overreacting or hyperbolic?

          I made a tongue-in-cheek statement about people who don't use their liberties and may not even know they have liberties because those don't factor into their lives in any meaningful way. Or, as I once explained to a Russian immigrant friend, a person living in the worst totalitarian country on earth ruled by the evilest of despots is perfectly free to say and do anything they like, so long as what they say and do is exactly what their government wants them to say and do. Hence the true measure of liberty is how well a nation tolerates citizens saying and/or doing things that 'authorities' and authoritarians do not approve of.

          There are a great many people who want their government to keep them safe from the ebil terrier-ists that same government keeps them terrified of, so they can comfortably and predictably go about their mundane daily lives. This includes eating vast amounts chemical garbage disguised as food to the point of gross obesity, taking too many drugs prescribed by too many Big Pharma drug dealers because they're advertised on teevee ("tell your doctor you need this drug!") straight to "consumers" who don't have any clue what it's for or how it works but are programmed to demand it anyway. Then having to take more drugs to counteract the side effects of the other drugs, a never-ending spiral toward serious disease and/or early death. Oh, and spending literal years of their lives vegetating in front of the flickering screen of said teevee allowing themselves to be hypnotized and have their brains filled with garbage, hype and overwhelming desire for things they don't need and cannot afford.

          I know some of these people quite well.

          Such people absolutely don't want to know any government secrets, or truths that might discomfort their worldview in any way. The government doesn't need to keep secrets from people who don't care. Secrets are kept from people who DO care about things governments like to keep secret. Such as the blanket abrogation of human and civil rights, brutalization of citizens who dare to exercise rights they no longer have, and the many other assorted atrocities governments are known to commit on a regular or semi-regular basis.

          •  and some people (0+ / 0-)

            merely disagree with your opinion

            In the time that I have been given,
            I am what I am

            by duhban on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 08:13:20 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  that's it? (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Joieau

              Joieau made a long, carefully explained point and all you can respond with is "I disagree with you"?
                 How is that "having an actual conversation"?

              “Wall Street had been doing business with pieces of paper; and now someone asked for a dollar, and it was discovered that the dollar had been mislaid.” ― Upton Sinclair

              by gjohnsit on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 08:36:44 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  I feel no need to inflate my words (0+ / 0-)

                simply to match Joieau in word count.

                This isn't a word count contest, I made my point that is all that matters.

                The fact is me and Joieau have been talking but from the looks of it we are simply not going to agree on this topic so what else is there to say? I suppose we could do the daily kos ritual insult but overall I find that tiresome.

                There is something to be said for saying only what you need to say.

                In the time that I have been given,
                I am what I am

                by duhban on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 09:28:05 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

        •  You seem unimpressed by anything other (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Joieau

          than your own opinion.

          Literally dozens to hundreds of links have been posts and facts which counteract your prevailing view.  Yet you want to say things like "get off your cross."

          You cannot have discussion without insults and hyperbole yourself.

          "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

          by YucatanMan on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 06:12:33 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I am unimpressed by (0+ / 0-)

            overreaction and insults

            And I think you mistake me for yourself. I've yet to see you have a conversation with anyone you don't agree with that deevolves into you insulting them .

            In the time that I have been given,
            I am what I am

            by duhban on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 08:12:43 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Link ? n/t (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Joieau

              "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

              by YucatanMan on Fri Jun 14, 2013 at 10:02:56 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  Sigh. (1+ / 0-)

              You descend into insults upon insults, then project those onto those you're insulting. I'd wager you don't even see what you're doing, same as you can't see what's wrong with this gub'mint's gross overreaction to ebil terrier-ists haunting nothing but the dark corners of their own minds. They believe you and I are ebil terrier-ists now. Because we live here and have lives that terrify the gub'mint. You probably don't see anything erroneous in that either.

              I can understand why they're scared of me. I'm a certified Senior Citizen. Worse, I am a notable dissenter and 'whistleblower' in their eyes, against an entire technology they invented just so they could threaten all Americans and everyone else in the whole fucking world with Instant Annihilation back when that was their favorite control-button of convenience. I live on a mountain so far out in the boonies you can't legally get any farther without a wilderness camping permit. I grow actual organic food for my family, and I'm big into alternative, renewable energy. Extremely dangerous.

              Why are they scared of you?

              •  last I checked (0+ / 0-)

                I have never called everyone and anyone I disagree with a fucking idiot nor recced a diary doing so

                Last I checked I have never told everyone and anyone that if you don't exactly agree with me you should get ready to be exterminated nor recced a diary doing so.

                Don't throw stones about insults Joieau you really don't have a leg to stand on.

                In the time that I have been given,
                I am what I am

                by duhban on Sat Jun 15, 2013 at 08:54:44 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

              •  duhban is... (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Joieau

                a troll who likes winding people up. Don't feed the troll any more. I won't either.

                'If you want to be a hero, well just follow me.' - J. Lennon

                by Clive all hat no horse Rodeo on Sun Jun 16, 2013 at 06:47:12 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

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