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View Diary: Greenwald Calls FISA Oversight A Sham (306 comments)

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  •  No, if some American calls me, they can record (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    k9disc, Indiana Bob

    because I'm in Canada.  So when I talk to all my American friends and family, all this communications can be captured and disseminated.  All without presenting any probable cause against me or anybody else to any court of law.

    We may have democracy, or we may have wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both. - Former Supreme Court Justice Louis Brandeis

    by RageKage on Tue Jun 18, 2013 at 10:58:17 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  Are you already targeted for surveilance? (0+ / 0-)

      I don't know how the system works but according to Mr Grreenwald:

      But even under the law, no individualized warrant is needed to listen in on the calls or read the emails of Americans when they communicate with a foreign national whom the NSA has targeted for surveillance.
      According to Mr Greenwald, this is not a large net system capturing everyone.
      •  And the NSA has targeted this person how? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Indiana Bob

        Why?

        There's the rub.

        Thump! Bang. Whack-boing. It's dub!

        by dadadata on Wed Jun 19, 2013 at 04:08:26 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Should gov't be allowed to monitor anyone (0+ / 0-)

          in the name of national security? Or arepersonal rights inviolate to the point when no one should ever be monitored for any purpose?

          If we agree that the gov't has legitimate monitoring responsibilites, that means some people will be monitored. The testimony before us from GG is that only calls to / from those on the monitored list are, well, monitored.

          •  I'd say it is analogous to the right (0+ / 0-)

            to be confronted by your accuser in "a court of law," e.g. in public.

            Thump! Bang. Whack-boing. It's dub!

            by dadadata on Wed Jun 19, 2013 at 10:12:04 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  That right still exists if matters come to trial (0+ / 0-)

              I know of know right suspects have to interfere during the law enforcement investigation phase. That's sort of doubled don't you think when the investigation target is a secretive organization that does not know its secrecy has been penetrated.

              "Oh, hi Mister bin Laden. We've been monitoring your plan to fly airliners into the World Trade Towers, and we'd like to see if you like to file any court challenges which might throw a monkey wrench into our investigation of you."

              This is not very realistic don't you think?

      •  How the hell would I know? (0+ / 0-)

        Maybe because I was actively opposing Keystone XL?  Maybe because I posted a lot in support of Occupy?  Maybe because I'm a criminal lawyer?  Who the hell knows?  That is the whole point.

        There is no oversight of who they target or why.

        We may have democracy, or we may have wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both. - Former Supreme Court Justice Louis Brandeis

        by RageKage on Wed Jun 19, 2013 at 07:16:18 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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