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View Diary: Obama's Spreading Secrecy Net (102 comments)

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  •  well for example (0+ / 0-)

    If Obama and the NSA are trying to make this a nation of secrets why are the declassifying massive parts of PRIM and company?

    I am not saying we shouldn't be having this conversation nor am I precisely happy with what is happening but a lot of it like the metadata is decades old.

    I guess I am still waiting for the smoking gun.

    In the time that I have been given,
    I am what I am

    by duhban on Wed Jun 19, 2013 at 03:28:53 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  I haven't seen them declassifying (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      3goldens, duhban

      massive amounts of information about PRISM. They have been forced to concede the existence of some of the documents that were published. They are still taking the position that everything about the NSA programs need to operate in complete secrecy in order to be effective.

      I really don't know what you would consider to be the smoking gun. What I see is a pattern that wasn't started by Obama, but has been extended and expanded by him. He is taking the public position that he has tinkered with it since taking office and thinks he has created the best of all possible arrangements. We are supposed to just accept that on faith. I don't think so.

      •  From what I understand (0+ / 0-)

        and have seen the NSA is working to declassify a lot of what PRISM has allegedly prevented.

        We will see what happens from there

        As to a smoking gun? Show me a systematic program that not only parses metadata but actually goes into the payload data and just randomly collects it without cause or warrant and then I will outraged.

        Right now, I don't know all I see is things I long thought the government did and it's hard to be outraged by that both because I am not surprised and because it's not really that egregious of an intrusion.

        In the time that I have been given,
        I am what I am

        by duhban on Wed Jun 19, 2013 at 03:54:17 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  They have made some broad claims (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          like 50 attacks. That is a long way from declassifying the details. So far its all spin to justify their secrecy.

          Your requirements for a smoking gun are far far more demanding than mine.

          •  well that's how it is for me (0+ / 0-)

            I tend to withhold judgement until it is indisputable

            In the time that I have been given,
            I am what I am

            by duhban on Wed Jun 19, 2013 at 05:20:57 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Right. Why not 5,000 attacks? Or 4? (0+ / 0-)

            Since it's all secret, even from the rubber stampers on the FISA court, pick a random number.

            Honestly, I don't understand why you "foil plots" and then claim that information is super-secret.

            I think if you want to discourage your Global Terist Enemies, you would be demonstrating over and over again in public and in detail that they will get nabbed.

            By NSA logic, Bin Laden would be dead and we would not have said a word to anyone.

            This begins to remind me of Elizabethan England.

            Thump! Bang. Whack-boing. It's dub!

            by dadadata on Thu Jun 20, 2013 at 03:57:49 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

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