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View Diary: Massive Oregon Bee Killing Update: Pesticide Temporarily Banned, Memorial Service Planned For Sunday (121 comments)

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  •  I thought about that... (5+ / 0-)
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    OllieGarkey, OregonOak, chimene, jayden, KenBee

    But no, we must stop worrying about what the opposition thinks about our respect for the environment. We must stop kowtowing to them. We've been doing that in electoral politics for decades, caving in on anything they ridicule, as if we are embarrassed to be who we are. And that is one big reason electoral politics have failed us over the decades.

    Read what the Xerces biologists have said about this occurrence, and how devastating it is to bumblebee populations. This is a really, really big deal. There is nothing wrong with memorializing the bees.

    And the deaths memorialized are really the tip of the iceberg. Since these two events happen to have occurred in an urban setting, more people are paying attention, but its a virtual certainty that this is occurring all over, and is not an isolated incident. These pesticides are ubiquitous.

    And get used to it. As climate change continues, we will seeing requiems composed for the entire planetary ecosystem before this century is over. This is just the beginning.

    Fuck the people who ridicule us. And fight back. Don't be ashamed to believe in respect for the ecological balance. Don't change your behavior. Don't conform to the ignorance. Stand proud for the bees, for the planet. It's the only world we have, and its going down fast.

    "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

    by ZhenRen on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 12:34:56 PM PDT

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    •  You know, I totally agree that we need to fight. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ZhenRen

      And the douchecanoes who ridicule us need to get called out for being the lying dicks that they are.

      But there's a way to use language, to use protest, and to use our collective voices to convince people who might not agree with us.

      There are the assholes who lie, and they're never going to agree with us. They've started believing our lies.

      But we have an opportunity to convince people on the fence, here. Those are the ones I'm worried about.

      I don't want them reading a headline and thinking "Wow, the hippies just had a memorial service for a bunch of bugs!"

      I want them thinking "Wow, I had no idea that so much of Oregon's economy depended on Bees!"

      Brocolli, Snap-Beans, Orchards, Wine, all of that stuff happens because of bees. Killing bees is a threat to the Oregonian way of life.

      That's the message I want heard.

      Look, I don't live in Oregon. I don't know how this is going to go over there. For strategic reasons, I'm going to be watching, and I'm glad this issue is being taken seriously, I'm just unsure about a memorial service as a tactic.

      You don't have to convince me how important bees are, btw. I grew up in Florida, and I remember how delicious orange honey was, and how everyone who grew citrus also had multiple apiaries out in the groves.

      An Fhirinn an aghaidh an t'Saoghail. (The truth against the world.) Is treasa tuath na tighearna. (The common people are mightier than the lords.)

      by OllieGarkey on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 12:55:23 PM PDT

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      •  Ollie I understand your point... (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        OllieGarkey, ZhenRen, chimene, jayden, KenBee

        but when you call it a Protest, then the Protesters are labled DFH's. When you call it a Demonstration, they call it a Love-in. When you call it an Action, they call in the military.

        It doesnt matter any more what we call ANYTHING. The smirking, leering ignorant clowns will debase the language. That is all they do.. debase the language. So, ignore what its called, forget about branding and just organize. Stick a finger in  their eyes, and laugh.

        We are going to be called Loons no matter what. Best get used to it, and work toward people accepting Loons as their neighbors and friends.

        Figures don't lie, but liars do figure-Mark Twain

        by OregonOak on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 01:04:59 PM PDT

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        •  I hear what you're saying. (0+ / 0-)

          And I'll absolutely agree that we shouldn't let fear paralyze us into refusing to act.

          A silly and ineffective protest is always better than no protest at all.

          An Fhirinn an aghaidh an t'Saoghail. (The truth against the world.) Is treasa tuath na tighearna. (The common people are mightier than the lords.)

          by OllieGarkey on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 04:21:58 PM PDT

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      •  But these sentiments should not be suppressed (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        OllieGarkey

        There are activists who create solidarity this way. Suppressing it would backfire. This is what can divide us.

        We need to build strength in our own communities, and work from that basis. It may be the most important approach at the moment, rather than negating the ones who may have the clearest vision.

        Let's not let them drag us all to the right by conforming to the status quo. It takes all kinds to populate a movement.

        I think one of the reasons we fail is because people respect authenticity, and Democrats lack that deep sense of comfort in their own skins that is attractive to independents. They're looking for spunk, and people who stand their ground, proud to be who they are. They can't stand the airy, ivory league liberals who talk down to them, who seem to artificially shape themselves into what is thought to be the image that will work. They sense bullshit when they smell it. Time to try another tack.

        "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

        by ZhenRen on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 01:19:15 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I could make an argument that (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          ZhenRen

          theater of the absurd is stuff that we've been doing since the 60's, and I also kind of resent the idea that I'm not "being who I am" by wanting to have a primarily serious issues-based conversation. We're not trying a different tack when we continue with the theatrics.

          I think we're having some trouble communicating, because I don't think you're trying to accuse me of anything, and I'm definitely not trying to suppress anything.

          I'm the guy who stands up and says that the overuse of pesticides and the death of pollinators are a serious threat to our economy, our way of life, and our ability to feed ourselves.

          But these sentiments should not be suppressed.
          There are activists who create solidarity this way. Suppressing it would backfire. This is what can divide us.
          I have no interest in suppressing anything. If people want to go ahead and have an event, by all means, they should do it.

          And I'm not there. I don't live in Oregon. I'm not going to ever tell anyone they shouldn't have a peaceful direct action, no matter what it is. We need to use every tactic available to us.

          I was just arguing that there's probably more effective messaging. But if this is an internal move to drum up internal support and build solidarity, rather than an attempt to educate the public, it does make a kind of sense.

          To be completely honest, if we're weak enough that having a frank discussion on messaging and strategy is the sort of thing that can divide the movement, then we're already fucked.

          I think one of the reasons we fail is because people respect authenticity, and Democrats lack that deep sense of comfort in their own skins that is attractive to independents.
          I can totally agree with that, but I don't see anything authentic about theatrics.

          I think that most people are smart enough to get what's going on if you just have enough faith in them to lay out the facts of the issues in plain speech.

          I'm just afraid that this is going to be similar to some of the theatrics we've seen in the past where people who don't know the facts or the issues make a big damn absurd noise, and end up turning off people who could otherwise be allies.

          And I think when we're drowning in bullshit as a society, there really is a place for fact-based, plainspoken activism working to inform the public.

          Honestly, if I lived in oregon, what I'd do would be to print up a bunch of fliers and pamphlets about the importance of bees to the Oregon economy and wine production, and start passing them out at wine stores and hanging them up in bars.

          Look, having done activism in Miami and New York I've seen a lot of theatrics, and I've seen a lot of people throw away a golden opportunity to change minds and sweep away the  bullshit by having events like these, and then not focusing at all on education, facts, or the next steps that can be taken.

          It's fun for the moment, but it atrophies quickly.

          I'm not trying to be a naysaying naysayer who naysays. I will even state that it's better that someone holds a memorial for the bees than for nothing at all to happen.

          They're trying something.

          That's awesome.

          I'm just hoping that there is more to this action than the theatrics. I hope that they use this as a jumping off point to create sustainable activism and agitation.

          And by the way, thanks for the excellent diary, thanks for making sure we got this information, and thanks for engaging me in discussion on this point.

          An Fhirinn an aghaidh an t'Saoghail. (The truth against the world.) Is treasa tuath na tighearna. (The common people are mightier than the lords.)

          by OllieGarkey on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 04:06:32 PM PDT

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          •  I attended the event (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            OllieGarkey, KenBee

            There were about 100 people. Speakers were serious, organized, informed, educated. I was one of the first to be handed a mic, and I gave my experience as a third generation beekeeper. A biologist spoke. Many people from the beekeeping community were there. The media covered the event.

            It was a good opportunity to expose the public to the problem. I was interviewed by a reporter.

            By the way, grapes get only minimal benefit from pollination, so I would pick a different crop to use as an example. Grapes are pollinated by wind and gravity. It isn't a major honey plant.

            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

            by ZhenRen on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 04:32:40 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  1, that's fucking AWESOME (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              ZhenRen

              and I withdraw my objections.

              2, you know a helluva lot more about bees than I do, but I know something about wine.

              Bees don't pollinate wine, but they're still vital to wine production. Take a look at this picture.

              Shitty soil makes shitty wine. That stuff growing between the vines is clover. Every decent vineyard on this planet either uses clover or mustard or some other flowering plant to enrich the soil's tilth.

              All of those plants need bees.

              If the bees go, the quality of the soil drops. In some cases, those supporting plants are the only reason that the soil is rich enough to grow wine at all. The vines will eventually die without them.

              The only way to make wine is to have a strong ecosystem. Otherwise you'll end up with tiny, wimpy grapes totally unsuited to fermentation. The vines might not have the nutrients they need to make grapes at all.

              Yeah, the grapes themselves aren't pollinated by bees, but bees are an important part of winemaking.

              No bees, no wine. The vineyards will rot without them.

              An Fhirinn an aghaidh an t'Saoghail. (The truth against the world.) Is treasa tuath na tighearna. (The common people are mightier than the lords.)

              by OllieGarkey on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 04:52:01 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

          •  One of the real benefits I saw (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            OllieGarkey, KenBee

            was the community building among activists that was going on. These events bring people together.

            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

            by ZhenRen on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 04:34:01 PM PDT

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            •  You've convinced me. (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              ZhenRen

              Good luck at keeping this thing going.

              If there's anything I can do to help all the way over here in New York, let me know.

              An Fhirinn an aghaidh an t'Saoghail. (The truth against the world.) Is treasa tuath na tighearna. (The common people are mightier than the lords.)

              by OllieGarkey on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 04:52:40 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

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