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View Diary: Cairo! 'Massive' doesn't do it justice. (158 comments)

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  •  There is also the Christian Brotherhood, as (10+ / 0-)

    several people are calling it.

    In Islam it is total submission to God, not to a state. Yes, there are those who conflate the two but it is no more inherent in that religion than in others.

    Christ himself is said to have said "Render unto Caesar" but that never stopped those bent on theocracy. In fact the whole point of today's demonstrations and the similar affairs in Libya, Tunisia and elsewhere is precisely this.  

    Simmons fan, by any chance?


    I refuse to believe corporations are people until Texas executes one.

    by Athenian on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 05:05:22 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  Bravo. n/t (0+ / 0-)
    •  You've mistaken me for a Christian. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      codairem, Noisy Democrat

      Which I am not.

      Islam does not separate church and state since all law is subordinate to the Quran.

      See the Iraqi Constitution for example.

      "The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Thomas Paine

      by shrike on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 05:54:37 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  No, I did not think you were Christian (0+ / 0-)

        I was asking about your screen name : )


        I refuse to believe corporations are people until Texas executes one.

        by Athenian on Sun Jun 30, 2013 at 06:20:17 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  WRONG (2+ / 0-)
        Islam does not separate church and state
        Maybe the Isalm that YOUR imam teaches you doesn't but hey -- there are many ways to interpret Islam (ask the Shi ites, Allawites, Sunnis, Druze, Salafis, etc etc etc). There is no Muslim "pope" who commands all Muslims.
        Turkey is an Islamic nation. It has (though  now its Quoran-thumpers seem to be wanting to go all fundamental) a secular state.
        Syria is an Islamic nation -- but the government now mindlessly killing its own citizens is/was a secular state. It massacred 20,000 Muslim Brotherhood members in 1982  to prove it.
        Sharia courts and sharia law do not supercede civil courts in these countries. Neither did they in Mubarek's Egypt.
        Religion has more of stranglehold on America's politics than it has with most Muslims in other countries.

        Ash-sha'b yurid isqat an-nizzam!

        by fourthcornerman on Mon Jul 01, 2013 at 02:30:13 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  You seem to know something about this (0+ / 0-)

          Can you tell me where I can find out more about mainstream interpretations of Islam that don't require the believer to do his utmost to establish a state governed by sharia? That seems to be the main bone of contention between Islamists and secularists. Where can I find a major school of Islamic jurisprudence that rules that separation of mosque and state is OK?

    •  but if you want to use Muslim (shariah) law (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Noisy Democrat

      as the basis for your state as some Muslims want to try out and some regimes do already have, then by definition you would be totally submitting to the authorities. You say it is to God, but like all formal religions they have people who are religious leaders who tell them how to submit to God. It seems that a religion that is based on total submission would be more at risk to totalitarianism if the choose religious law as their basis for their law. There are other religions that do not demand total submission and in fact encourage questioning more.

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