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View Diary: BREAKING: Have We Been Snowed? New Part 2 Of Snowden's Interview & A Writer's Link (Video) (111 comments)

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  •  TPM reporter casts doubt on Ars Technica 'chatlog' (14+ / 0-)

    The Ars Technica 'chatlogs' purportedly by Snowden were the subject of a diary about two weeks ago -- so hardly 'breaking'.  

    TalkingPointsMemo,com published a piece reporting on the Ars Techica article about the chatlogs.  Josh Marshall is a very careful and cautious journalist & editor, and even though he is personally very uncomfortable with Snowden (and had written about this), the article on his website contains a carefully-phrased disclaimer about the Ars Technica 'chatlogs'.

    Here's the comment I posted in the diary two weeks ago:

    http://www.dailykos.com/...

     Diarist omits important caveat in TPM article (1+ / 0-)
    Having now read the TPM article, I see that the diarist has omitted mention of one important piece of its treatment of the Ars Technica article.  From TPM:

    According to Ars Technica, once TheTrueHOOHA’s forum postings became public, “multiple longtime users of the site” turned in logs from unarchived Ars Technica chatrooms that seem to include Snowden corresponding as TheTrueHOOHA.
    Let's unpack that:
    1.  Ars Technica does not archive the relevant chatrooms.  
    2. Once the 'Snowden = AT Username' info became public, " “multiple longtime users of the site” turned in logs" (italics here indicate Ars Technica's words.)
    3. It is info from these 'multiple longtime users' logs that "seem to include Snowden corresponding as TheTrueHOOHA."

    I've been reading TPM for over a decade now, and owner/editor Josh Marshall maintains very high editorial standards.  As a longtime reader, it 's clear to me that the careful structure in the quote above is TPM's way of letting careful readers know that the 'logs' turned in by 'multiple longtime users' are not beyond questioning.

    The 'logs' were not part of an archive that had been maintained over the years by Ars Technica.  Their provenance is questionable, and with their uncertain provenance their accuracy also become questionable.

    In the last few paragraphs, the TPM writer quitely reasserts that the 'evidence' of the logs is not entirely trustworthy:

    Assuming TheTrueHOOHA was indeed Snowden, his 2009 conversations indicate his view of the government and leakers changed substantially in the years between his time in Switzerland and his current life as a self-described whistleblower on the run with Wikileaks. However, in an interview with the Guardian, one of the newspapers that published his leaked documents, Snowden indicated he did indeed have a change of heart during his time in Geneva. According to the Guardian, that period is when Snowden “thought for the first time about exposing government secrets.”

    “Much of what I saw in Geneva really disillusioned me about how my government functions and what its impact is in the world,” Snowden told the paper. “I realised that I was part of something that was doing far more harm than good.”

    You'll have to go back to the diary that I made this comment in to find the TPM link.  You'll like that diary.  It pushes the same meme you're pushing here.

    And btw, when did this 'addicting info' website become a credible source?  I've only begun seeing it cited in the last few weeks.  It seems pretty tabloid-y.

    Just to simplify the point of my two-week old comment:  Since Ars Technica does not maintain archives of its chatlogs, the information being passed as 'by Snowden' could have been generated by anyone who wanted to smear Snowden -- and there are plenty who do.

    •  The 'Breaking' is in the new release of Part 2 of (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Sylv, nzanne

      Snowden's interview with the Guardian.

      "In this world, hate has never yet dispelled hate. Only love can dispel hate." ~ Buddha

      by Leslie Salzillo on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 04:19:24 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  So this diary is a bait-and-switch? (7+ / 0-)

        Using the Guardian video (which has also been covered here today, so again, hardly 'breaking') to lure readers into a diary re-posting the Ars Technica 'chatlog' material that has already been shown to be bogus?

        And who is this 'us'?

        [Ars Technica re-poster is] 'one of us'. Tery Steelman researches a bit more of Snowden's true colors.
        So, is this 'us' a group of character assassins?   Just curious.
        •  No, it's not a bait and switch. Calm down... (6+ / 0-)

          The release of Part 2 of the Snowden interview was breaking to me. When I found it was only minutes old and I posted it here. I did not see it had been posted here earlier.

          I added my friend's article because I had not read or heard about this transcripts until last night and found it fascinating.

          I wish some of our members would stop playing, "GOTCHA!!!" and assuming diarists are out to 'fool' everyone or writing with malice or dishonesty. The majority of us don't get paid to write here. At least I don't.

          And many of the worst critics are members who do not write diaries at all. Try it sometime. It's not so easy.

          "In this world, hate has never yet dispelled hate. Only love can dispel hate." ~ Buddha

          by Leslie Salzillo on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 04:55:35 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  It was only minutes old? (5+ / 0-)

            The Guardian story and the video were published before noon eastern.


            "Justice is a commodity"

            by joanneleon on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 05:26:35 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  GOTCHA! (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Sylv, Leslie Salzillo, Larsstephens

              Assume diarist is out to fool everybody, maliciously and dishonestly.  Or, maybe, take it at face value

              [it]was breaking to me. When I found it was only minutes old

              “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

              by Catte Nappe on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 05:30:38 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  No. (6+ / 0-)

                original diary title can be seen in your browser's address bar above. Then there were just two videos posted with absolutely no commentary or links to daily banter or addicting info.

                And again, no. I usually read and rec this diarist's submissions.

                •  Thanks, WhenIn Rome nt (5+ / 0-)

                  And you're right.  Title bar in browser shows different title than diary itself.

                •  WheninRome - I never posted two videos. One is (0+ / 0-)

                  the photo.

                   #2 There was commentary originally posted. Where are you getting this information? Why would I post a diary without commentary?

                  #3 I added the writer's link and then added it to the title to reflect the same within about 10 minutes of posting.

                  #4 I did not see that another diarist had posted or I would not have posted. I scrolled down but not far enough.

                  You are accusing diarists of conspiring. Why? Come off it.

                  Just because you say these things, and you say them the 'loudest' -doesn't make them true

                  "In this world, hate has never yet dispelled hate. Only love can dispel hate." ~ Buddha

                  by Leslie Salzillo on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 09:02:05 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Good grief - one day I will hopefully figure out (0+ / 0-)

                    these comment threads as it looks someone is responding to the comment above, when the response is for a comment much further up.

                    Joaneleon, you are correct. The video was released around noon. That said - I did not see it until around 5pm and the google search said '48 minutes ago.' So I thought it's breaking info.

                    I scrolled down the stories to see if anyone had posted, I did not scroll down far enough. I posted. Then I added my friend (who might not want to be friends with me now) story to the diary and the title.

                    That's all. I wasn't trying to step on your story, which looks like it did very well.

                    "In this world, hate has never yet dispelled hate. Only love can dispel hate." ~ Buddha

                    by Leslie Salzillo on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 11:07:52 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

              •  Why are you (5+ / 0-)

                responding to me with this ridiculous comment?

                I stated a fact.  This diary was published after 5 eastern. Diarist says the video was only minutes old at the time.  I know for a fact that it wasn't. It was published at least 5 hours before that.

                How is that a gotcha?


                "Justice is a commodity"

                by joanneleon on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 05:37:12 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  You know what? (3+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Barton Funk, Klusterpuck, dadoodaman

                  Never mind, Catte Nappe.  I don't even want to hear whatever crap you'll come up with on that.


                  "Justice is a commodity"

                  by joanneleon on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 05:37:45 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                •  She says it was new to her (5+ / 0-)

                  It happens on a regular basis. Somebody posts something that, to them, was breaking news; unaware for various reasons that others have already been on the story. I think I was one of, possibly even the first, comment noting that it was already a topic of hot debate on the rec list.

                  So why assume negative intent? Why not take it on face value - it was new to her. She's done some really good work on this site, she's not a "seagull" or a "spammer" or a "troll". She found something she thought would be of interest, and shared it. And added other information related to it that might likewise be of interest  to some.

                  But assumption of negative intent is the MO on this topic evidently, since I now see a follow up comment from you that anything I might have to say about this must be "crap". Sight unseen, if it's my response, it must therefore be "crap". Yeah - "gotcha", and assume the worst intent.

                  “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

                  by Catte Nappe on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 06:17:49 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                •  When I found the link on google while researching (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  nzanne

                  Snowden, google said the story I posted was 48 minutes old. I thought it newsworthy, especially to this site.

                  "In this world, hate has never yet dispelled hate. Only love can dispel hate." ~ Buddha

                  by Leslie Salzillo on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 06:38:15 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  thank you, btw, Leslie - (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Leslie Salzillo

                    I am reading many POV on this, and really trying to keep out of the catfights.

                    I appreciate your posts.

                    [And others', ok, don't anyone jump me for being civil.]

                    "Only a Vulcan mind meld will help with this congress." Leonard Nimoy, 3/1/13

                    by nzanne on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 06:50:23 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

    •  Except that saying things supportive (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      AaronInSanDiego, Larsstephens

      of Ron Paul and against Social Security don't really qualify as smears in most quarters. They are only smears to us. So if you are right, some nefarious party intervened just to sink Snowden with the left. That seems a bit unlikely to me.

    •  Addicting info has been around since before (4+ / 0-)

      the last election.

      Your not having any knowledge of it does not call into question its credibility. Until this Snowden story, I had never heard of you, either, and we've both been here almost 7 years.

      I'd like to start a new meme: "No means no" is a misnomer. It should be "Only 'Yes' means yes." Just because someone doesn't say "No" doesn't mean they've given consent. If she didn't say "Yes", there is no consent.

      by second gen on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 04:25:10 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  as to whether... (0+ / 0-)

      Snowden was "TheTrueHOOHA", why not just ask him? Surely "heroes" don't lie...

      "It's almost as if we're watching Mitt Romney on Safari in his own country." -- Jonathan Capeheart

      by JackND on Mon Jul 08, 2013 at 04:34:12 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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