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View Diary: Should Animals Have the Right Not to be Tortured or Killed? (288 comments)

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  •  We are all animals. n/t (8+ / 0-)

    "The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Thomas Paine

    by shrike on Sat Jul 13, 2013 at 06:22:02 PM PDT

    •  True (4+ / 0-)

      But I'm wondering if we've went so far off the evolutionary track that we can still say that. What other animal flies a supersonic jet or has a courtship ritual through a computer?

      "If the machine of government is of such a nature that it requires you to be the agent of injustice to another, then, I say, break the law." - Henry David Thoreau

      by Jason Hackman on Sat Jul 13, 2013 at 06:30:39 PM PDT

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    •  point being? n/t (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ZenTrainer, sagesource

      Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

      by corvo on Sat Jul 13, 2013 at 06:41:05 PM PDT

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      •  Survival of the fittest. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ZenTrainer, ban nock

        Sad, we are predators.

        "The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Thomas Paine

        by shrike on Sat Jul 13, 2013 at 06:49:40 PM PDT

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        •  I don't detect much sadness in your comment. (5+ / 0-)

          We're a bit different from other predators.  If I really have to tell you how . . . ?

          Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

          by corvo on Sat Jul 13, 2013 at 06:53:23 PM PDT

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        •  I'm not sure we are the fittest or that flying (3+ / 0-)

          planes and dating via tube are good measures of superiority. We may have slid sown the evolutionary track.

          Tracy B Ann - technically that is my signature. If I had Bill Gates money, I'd buy Detroit.

          by ZenTrainer on Sat Jul 13, 2013 at 07:33:40 PM PDT

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          •  I think that we've changed (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            SuWho, Christin, gene s

            enough to the point where we can no longer claim that we're "natural", so to say we need to eat meat because we're animals (which is what I think was implied) and it's in our nature is far from the truth. During my college years I partially subsisted on Doritos and beer. What other kind of animal can do that? As animals, left to struggle against the elements in even moderate weather, I don't think most of us wouldn't last two weeks. I can't say that makes us superior, just different... but definitely not animals.

            "If the machine of government is of such a nature that it requires you to be the agent of injustice to another, then, I say, break the law." - Henry David Thoreau

            by Jason Hackman on Sat Jul 13, 2013 at 07:54:02 PM PDT

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            •  I think bears can live on Dorito's and beer. ;-) (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Jason Hackman, grover

              Tracy B Ann - technically that is my signature. If I had Bill Gates money, I'd buy Detroit.

              by ZenTrainer on Sat Jul 13, 2013 at 11:45:41 PM PDT

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              •  Deer in areas where humans feed them (3+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                ZenTrainer, Jason Hackman, Lilredhead

                Crap do as well-- like outside major national parks (inside, the rangers will cite you).

                Every once in a while, a deer will be found dead and they'll do a necropsy. They'll see that the deer had been clearly living on Cheetos, chips, pancakes, etc for apparently a long time based on stomach contents, bloodwork, liver biopsies, etc.

                Obviously, though, they're just as healthy as humans who "live" on that crap though.

                © grover


                So if you get hit by a bus tonight, would you be satisfied with how you spent today, your last day on earth? Live like tomorrow is never guaranteed, because it's not. -- Me.

                by grover on Sun Jul 14, 2013 at 12:33:35 AM PDT

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          •  "Survival of the fittest" is not technically (0+ / 0-)

            accurate.

            There's no "evolutionary track" that we're supposed to be on that we can "slide off."

            we can no longer claim that we're "natural"
            Many species of animals use tools. Are they not "natural?"

            There is no set path of evolution where we're at the "top" and can "slide down."

            When we stop putting leaders from the past up on pedestals and ignoring their flaws, we can start seeing our present leaders for what they really are.

            by PhillyJeff on Sun Jul 14, 2013 at 11:57:22 PM PDT

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        •  The fittest ? (0+ / 0-)

          Like a gold medal winner ?

          http://www.ecorazzi.com/...

          Carl Lewis
          Carl Lewis is probably the most well known, historic vegan Olympian in the world or at least the U.S. He won 10 Olympic medals, 9 of which were gold. His Olympic career ran from 1979 to 1996. He wrote an introduction for Jannequin Bennett in her book “Very Vegetarian” saying, “It’s a myth that muscles, strength and endurance require the consumption of large quantities of animal-based foods. This myth began before anyone even talked about protein.” He ended his introduction with, “Your body is your temple. If you nourish it properly, it will be good to you and you will increase its longevity.”
          http://en.wikipedia.org/...
          "Sportsman of the Century" by the International Olympic Committee and being named "Olympian of the Century" by the American sports magazine Sports Illustrated.

          The standard you walk past is the standard you accept. David Morrison

          by indycam on Sun Jul 14, 2013 at 06:26:14 PM PDT

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