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View Diary: Wendy Davis: Texas GOP's War on Women's health goes much deeper than one anti-abortion bill (48 comments)

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  •  For the people voting for these laws (1+ / 0-)
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    I love OCD

    I believe a lot has to do with ignorance and disinformation.

    A discussion with my moderate friend revealed that he's ok with abortions before 20 weeks.  But then after that, once the fetus is forming, he's more uncomfortable with the idea of abortions.  That's just ignorance.  Not really his fault; he's married but doesn't have kids (although him and his wife are thinking about starting a family) and thinking about abortions or reading about how shutting down clinics will affect primarily low-income minority women doesn't really affect him because he's white and middle-class.

    I talked to him a little bit about the effects it will have on Texas women if they close down the clinics and while I don't think I swayed his views completely, he definitely listened and it's just a matter of pushing more facts his way.

    A discussion with my hardline evanglical "friend" (who to her credit, is mostly well-meaning and keeps most of her views to herself rather than proselytizing to anyone that will listen within earshot) said that she's totally against abortions because she believes the bible teaches "life begins at conception" and that she is "speaking for the baby that has no voice" and "wonders about the thoughts of the baby in the womb and asking it if it really wants to be aborted". (!?)

    That's a combination of ignorance AND disinformation.  The religious right hijacked the abortion debate (among other things) and suddenly made it this terrible sin to have an abortion by selecting Bible verses out of context.  No surprise there.

    And of course, just plain punishing people who have sex.  Another Christian friend pretty said straight up that people just shouldn't have sex.  "Why can't they just keep their legs closed?  They made their bed, now they can just lie in it."

    •  So.. about (3+ / 0-)
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      I love OCD, betterdemsonly, cybersaur

      your evangelical 'friend' did you ask her if she is so against abortion does she support  free and easy access to birth control and comprehensive sex education in public schools, because that would reduce the actual need for abortions in all but rare circumstances like rape, incest, life of mother? I suspect she was against these measures since they would be common sense.  I am sure that the other 'Christian' friend would be against it as well.  

      My point in asking - to prove that it is nothing but forcing the lawmakers religious beliefs on others - which if they want to be that kind of country then they need to re-read the Constitution.  

      I am going to start asking 'nicely' all the people I see with 'Pro-life' bumper stickers if they are supporting free and easy access to birth control and comprehensive sex education in public schools.  Just to see if they can see the logic in actual pregnancy prevention as the first and critical step in reducing abortions.  I suspect that logic won't play into the discussion at all. SAD

      Why do Republicans Hate Americans?

      by Caniac41 on Mon Jul 15, 2013 at 10:24:17 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I did ask her about comprehensive sex ed (0+ / 0-)

        and access to birth control and about rape and incest.  I even pointed her to some links showing how better access to contraceptives lowered teen pregnancy rates.

        She basically deflected my question and said that I was focusing on the "economic side" of the debate while she was more worried about the morality of "bringing more people to Christ".  I ended the discussion at that point.

        And I agree, most politicans who play the religious card are pushing these laws are not Christians.  They just say things like, "All life is worth fighting for." and "This is God's will" and all that other BS just to play to their base and keep their job.

        Evanglicals and hardline "pro-lifers" won't listen to logic and reason.  That's why I talk more about this issue with my moderate friend.  Intelligent moderates are the ones to aim for when trying to sway public opinion.

        •  Yes (2+ / 0-)
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          betterdemsonly, backslide

          intelligent moderates are the people to discuss this issue with.  Hardline 'christianists' could care less about anything but their 'moral' beliefs.  

          I will also ask the 'Pro-life' bumper sticker people if the conversation is going smoothly, how much they support pre-k education and increasing minimum wage and food stamps for the poor as a stop gap to starvation. I also want to ask them their stand on the death penalty.  It shouldn't surprise me but it does that these 'every life is precious' people are the first to make sure that their state has and uses the death penalty - Rick Perry is the prime example of this.

          My hope, is to try to nicely show their hypocrisy.

          Why do Republicans Hate Americans?

          by Caniac41 on Mon Jul 15, 2013 at 11:23:13 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Clearly she selectively reads the Bible (0+ / 0-)

          ...what about all those fully-developed, already-born Egyptian children slaughtered by god's angel of death in Exodus?

          Also, a good tactic here is to point out that restricting access to abortion DOES NOT REDUCE abortion rates. It simply makes them less safe. Desperate women stay desperate.

          I always say to my religious friends, "It's perfectly okay and understandable to be pro-life with regard to your own life and body, but everyone needs to understand the importance of having pro-choice laws"

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