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View Diary: Anti-vaccine quack Jenny McCarthy joins "The View" as new co-host (207 comments)

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  •  "evidenced-based" pharmaceutical research (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    protectspice

    in the US is mostly faith-based.

    Flacking for Big Pharma

    “There’s a lot of bribery involved—the kids get pizza, the grownups get trips to Hawaii,” observed Marcia Angell, MD, professor of social medicine at the Harvard Medical School, former editor-in-chief of the New England Journal of Medicine (NEJM), and the author in 2004 of The Truth About the Drug Companies: How They Deceive Us and What to Do About It.
    First, do no harm.  Spacing out vaccines is a sensible course of action.
      •  The AAP can go fuck themselves (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        protectspice

        http://www.medscape.com/...

        In 1999, the AAP, in a joint statement with the US Public Health Service, advocated for elimination of mercury in vaccines but retired that recommendation in 2002. Three commentaries published simultaneously in Pediatrics support the AAP endorsement, provide perspective, and advocate for the continued use of thimerosal in vaccines.
        How Independent Are Vaccine Defenders?
        The vaccine industry gives millions to the Academy of Pediatrics for conferences, grants, medical education classes and even helped build their headquarters. The totals are kept secret, but public documents reveal bits and pieces.

        A $342,000 payment from Wyeth, maker of the pneumococcal vaccine - which makes $2 billion a year in sales.

        A $433,000 contribution from Merck, the same year the academy endorsed Merck's HPV vaccine - which made $1.5 billion a year in sales.

        Another top donor: Sanofi Aventis, maker of 17 vaccines and a new five-in-one combo shot just added to the childhood vaccine schedule last month.

        •  strawman (5+ / 0-)

          That pharmaceutical companies give money is NOT evidence that vaccines are unsafe.

        •  ummm, no thanks. (7+ / 0-)

          Dr. Paul Offit is a research scientist at the University of Pennsylvania, the same institution that I am a graduate student at.  He is a fantastic scientist and leader in vaccine research as well as active in countering anti-vaccine bullshit.

          BTW, just for the record, when I was mentioning people at Daily Kos who are anti-vax, you were one of the people I had in mind.

          "Give me a lever long enough... and I shall move the world." - Archimedes

          by mconvente on Mon Jul 15, 2013 at 01:35:10 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I didn't say anything about Paul Offit (0+ / 0-)

            And glad to know that you think my links are bullshit.  :D

            •  Well then it's clear you didn't read the paper (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              akeitz

              From the comment to which you commented, "The AAP can go fuck themselves"

              Because Dr. Offit is one of the toe authors for that publication.

              And yeah, a lot of your links are bullshit.

              "Give me a lever long enough... and I shall move the world." - Archimedes

              by mconvente on Mon Jul 15, 2013 at 02:10:38 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  *the authors. Stupid iPhone... N/t (0+ / 0-)

                "Give me a lever long enough... and I shall move the world." - Archimedes

                by mconvente on Mon Jul 15, 2013 at 02:11:09 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

              •  which ones (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                protectspice

                You say, "CT, CT" but you are vague on particulars.

                You are right, I didn't notice Offit's name as one of the authors.  But I did read the paper.

                Between the two of us, if you know Offit personally, it's hard to say that you are unbiased in this debate, as he certainly is deeply involved in this whole issue.

                •  I haven't met him (not yet at least) (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  akeitz, renzo capetti

                  We're trying to schedule him to speak as part of a graduate student-led science organization that I'm a founding member of.

                  And if you want to call me biased for unequivocally supporting the most critically important invention in the history of modern medicine, that almost universally led to the massive increases in life expectancy we saw in the early 20th Century (sanitation and refrigeration were important as well), then be my freaking guest.

                  "Give me a lever long enough... and I shall move the world." - Archimedes

                  by mconvente on Mon Jul 15, 2013 at 02:27:54 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I strongly support most vaccinations (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    protectspice, Karl Rover

                    My children are fully vaccinated with the required vaccines.  I have never said anything against the polio vaccine, for example.

                    I am just saying examine the actual evidence for particular vaccines and especially for newer vaccines, don't believe everything you hear from groups and doctors given huge sums of money by the vaccine industry.  Weigh the risks against the benefits.

                    You are calling me CT, a bannable offense.  I am merely calling you biased because, well, your last comment doesn't exactly sound impartial.

                    Offit sounds like a real charmer:

                    http://www.ocregister.com/...

                    Get the f*ck out of here! Piece of sh*t!

                    •  Oh please (4+ / 0-)

                      A fucking website called "Age of Autism", a clearly anti-vax propaganda venue.

                      Why don't you read this (bold my emphasis):

                      AOA 07.15.13. Hooray for Jenny!

                      Barbara Walters announced this morning that Jenny McCarthy will be joining the view in September. So much for all the whining and sniveling by the vaccine-injury deniers.

                      And you're calling me biased?

                      I have been willing to hold my tongue for you, especially regarding spacing out vaccines - not entirely a bad idea, though research has shown it has no bad effects.

                      But you entirely lost your credibility when you start linking anti-vax propaganda from a clear stalker (being Jake Crosby) of Dr. Offit.  THAT'S what I'm talking about when I say you peddle CT, because that's all Mr. Crosby has to offer.  What a pathetic item for you to link to, but I'm not surprised coming from you.  What fucking bullshit.

                      And for the record, if I had people like that asshole Jake Crosby following me around and spouting out complete lies about the links between vaccines and autism, I'd respond exactly like Dr. Offit responded.  You're damn right Mr. Crosby is a piece of shit.

                      "Give me a lever long enough... and I shall move the world." - Archimedes

                      by mconvente on Mon Jul 15, 2013 at 03:32:48 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

              •  also, a link to rebut the particular part of that (0+ / 0-)

                article that recommends mercury in vaccines:

                http://iaomt.org/...

          •  It's quite interesting that you want me personally (0+ / 0-)

            banned for CT.  I didn't know that posting links to CBS News was a bannable offense.

        •  And btw... (4+ / 0-)

          EVERYONE has endorsed the HPV vaccine.  Well, everyone except Michele Bachmann.  Do you really want to be on the same side on this issue as her?  Give me a break.

          "Give me a lever long enough... and I shall move the world." - Archimedes

          by mconvente on Mon Jul 15, 2013 at 01:37:08 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Most healthcare providers (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          mconvente, akeitz

          that advocate for vaccines get absolutely no compensation.

          Giving money to the professional associations is not that same as handing bags of cash to primary care providers, all of the sane ones advocate for vaccines.

          I don't know off the top of my head how many Kossacks are MDs or RNs but I think you would find few among that group who do not advocate for the necessity of vaccinations.

          The thing that annoys me when I get accused of being a "tool of big pharma" by people is that I think damn and I am doing it for free.....

          •  I didn't say "tool of big pharma" I said (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            undercovercalico, protectspice

            that there are good vaccines and there are bad vaccines.  All I am saying is buyer beware, to actually look at the data.  Also look at where the top people, who are influencing the majority of healthcare providers, get their funding.  And that the concept of spacing out vaccines is sensible.

            •  Oh, I should not (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              cordgrass

              have implied you were doing that. I do get that quite a bit when I explain my stance on vaccines. Guess we just have to agree to disagree on the spacing thing. I am a nurse the most anybody tries to bribe us with is pizza or a free meal at a conference. We aren't the power hub in the healthcare system.

              And most MDs are not tools of the system and in most cases fighting it to provide safe quality care. The top people are generally viewed as being "political" in the same way top generals are which means their ability to influence varies widely.

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