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View Diary: Detroit bankruptcy on hold, Snyder admin. smacked down by judge for "cheating good people who work" (267 comments)

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  •  maybe all of the residents of Detroit deserve a (0+ / 0-)

    future that collects the garbage each week and can respond to a 911 call in less than one hour...even if that means some city employees take a haircut.

    I subscribe to the statement from Star Trek One:  "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few."

    Cause he gets up in the morning, And he goes to work at nine, And he comes back home at five-thirty, Gets the same train every time.

    by Keith930 on Fri Jul 19, 2013 at 05:36:45 PM PDT

    •  Here's what concerns me (4+ / 0-)

      Current city employees could, perhaps, take a cut in pay and/or in future retirement benefits. Those with the skills could always look for better compensated jobs elsewhere (though who knows if they'd be successful).

      The big problem is with retirees: I don't know how many retired Detroit civil servants there are; I presume the number is fairly hefty. They worked, they earned their pensions, they planned their retirements assuming they'd receive those pensions. Depending on how their retirement system works they may not have paid into Social Security, meaning that their only source of income is their pensions (plus whatever savings they may have accrued). Rents may be relatively low in Detroit but if you have no income it's really tough to pay ANY rent. Where are these people supposed to go and how are they supposed to live? How is it in anyone's interest to suddenly create a significant population of indigent seniors?

      •  There appears to be ~20K retirees and there not... (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        sfbob, Eclectablog, Amber6541, Aquarius40

        covered by SS (unless from another job). The average cop/firefighter pension is $28K. Googled the mess and found this NYT link:

        Until mid-June, there was one ray of hope in Detroit’s gathering storm: For all the city’s problems, its pension fund was in pretty good shape. If the city went under, its thousands of retired clerks, police officers, bus drivers and other workers would still be safe.

        Then came bad news. Seemingly out of nowhere, a $3.5 billion hole appeared in Detroit’s pension system, courtesy of calculations by a firm hired by the city’s emergency manager.

        The article goes on to say the problem has to do with the projected rate of return on investment was ~7%/year and that had to be lowered so all of sudden Motown pension funds went in the red. And it's a countrywide problem.
    •  That's why I'm warming to bankruptcy... (0+ / 0-)

      It's humiliating, but the simple fact is that there's less money in Detroit then there used to be,. The people who live there suffer from this all the time. They pay ridiculous tax rates, lots of mini-fee that are stealth tax rates (ie: the garbage fee, high auto insurance, pribvaty6e security, etc.). They also get basically no city services for all this money.

      If the city can;t make it's pension fund payments (and it hasn't for years), while the people are suffering this much the least immoral thing to do is gut the pensions.

      It's not nice. It's not right. But it's less unjust then simply decreeing that people who live in Detroit will have to pay more money to fund some cops Florida retirement.

      BTW, relatively few retirees live in the City proper. Even active City employees frequently move out. If you have a $30k pension regardless of where you live, why wouldn't you move to Florida?

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