Skip to main content

View Diary: President Obama: One of the worst Presidents ever (126 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  I'd say (4+ / 0-)

    "The best we could do." covers mediocre. Of course it lacks the personal sting of the latter.

    Nothing human is alien to me.

    by WB Reeves on Sun Jul 21, 2013 at 04:15:34 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  So too does "Better than his four predecessors" (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      WB Reeves

      Pretty much.

      •  Yep (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Quicklund

        I guess it just doesn't register high enough on the nastiness scale.

        Nothing human is alien to me.

        by WB Reeves on Sun Jul 21, 2013 at 04:35:12 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  No, the problem with both answers... (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Quicklund, WB Reeves, corvo

          ...is I don't think he's the best we could have done, just the best the party and the figures behind the scenes let us do.  I don't think it's wise to concede that they should always have their way.  Though it's difficult to prevent it.  Still, hold out that hope.  So that answer doesn't work for me.

          As for better than the four predecessors, I'm not sure he'll be better than Clinton, . . . and I really didn't like Clinton and still don't.  I see practically no light between Obama and the Clintons in terms of aims or performance.  Dems have been disappointing me for many years.

          I'll stick with the answer I gave above.

          •  Fair enough (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            dance you monster, Quicklund

            Obviously my crack about nastiness was misplaced.

            Nothing human is alien to me.

            by WB Reeves on Sun Jul 21, 2013 at 05:11:49 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Define 'could have done'. Sure, there are people (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            WB Reeves

            who would have been better Presidents. But did any of them have any chance of getting elected?

            •  Define, shit (0+ / 0-)

              Most Americans are very disappointed in Obama's job competence. They like his speeches. They like HIM. But even African Americans give him a MEDIOCRE job approval percentage, probably lower than everyone else, because they know better than anyone else if the economy has improved or not.

              And it hasn't. Because Obama's strategy has been, for four long years-plus, to wait and hope.

              I'm tired of people defending Obama. I don't want him impeached or removed from office...I want RESULTS.

              If more Democrats and Americans actually wanted these results, there'd be more pressure on him. But too many Americans are giving him a complete pass, waiting for 2017...

              "I feel a lot safer already."--Emil Sitka

              by DaddyO on Mon Jul 22, 2013 at 07:21:07 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

          •  Present theory of American politics (0+ / 0-)

            Good Cop, Bad Cop. Democrats get you a 7-up from the soda machine while the Republicans beat the shit out of you with a rubber hose.

            But to both Parties, the American citizen is a permanent SUSPECT.

            "I feel a lot safer already."--Emil Sitka

            by DaddyO on Mon Jul 22, 2013 at 07:17:43 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  Well (0+ / 0-)

          "mediocre" isn't really nasty. But I think he's done better than that, considering the conditions he faced on Jan '09.

          Then again I voted for "better than his 4 predecessors", and I think he deserves better than mediocre. So clearly I am all over the map.

          Well as they say, historians need the perspective of time before judgement can be made. That's why I took the easier to justify "better than the previous four".

      •  we'll see (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        dance you monster, Quicklund

        history may rate clinton above him. they're very similar on many issues.

        The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

        by Laurence Lewis on Sun Jul 21, 2013 at 04:48:41 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I might live long enough to hear the early results (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          FG, gffish, Ahianne

          Today I'm inclined to put GHW Bush ahead of WJ Clinton. GHWB's diplomacy during the Gulf War was masterful. People forget he had the USSR (still in business then) OK a war against one of the USSR's key client states.

          Plus he knew far better than his son not to go on to Baghdad.

          Later he oversaw the fall of the Berlin Wall and the USSR itself. But those were peaceful events that transpired more smoothly than anyone would have dared hope just a few years before?

          Exactly.

          Plus the GOP did read his lips, and they threw him oout for raising taxes. In 2013, I gotta give a GOP POTUS nod of appreciation for that.

          President Clinton?

          Well he had the post Cold War boom and a nice economy during which he... oversaw a lot of half-measures.  I'm sure others can fill in the blanks but as for me I am drawing them.

          Gotta love him for destroying Gingrich though, when it was Gingrich who set out to destroy Clinton.

          •  i'm no fan of the gulf war (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Quicklund, Ahianne

            and he still left clinton with a struggling economy and record deficits. everyone said his successor would be a one-termer, because of the economy he'd inherit. he was also up to his ears in iran-contra, then pardoned the criminals. he had nothing to do with the fall of iron curtain, and in fact his people acted as if it wasn't happening.

            The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

            by Laurence Lewis on Sun Jul 21, 2013 at 05:29:56 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  GHWB Did not start the Gulf War (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Laurence Lewis, FG

              I don't think there are many "fans" of war. But when a war must be fought it makes a bit of sense to fight it well. And that GHWB did do well. He had world opinion behind that effort, not some mealy "Coalition of the Willing".

              It is naive to suggest the leader of the most powerful nation on Earth had no influence in how the Iron Curtain fell. As I said... no drama is the way to do it. Even if the lack of blood-filled gutters made it look easy, it warn't easy.

              Yes, he was involved in Iran-Contra. He weasled his way out of it but we all know better. But we are not rating Vice-Presidencies. We are comparing POTUS 41 and 42. I doubt a POTUS Bush would have been bamboozled into I-C by his staff the way a senile POTUS  Reagan was... but that's going down a tangential path.

              41 left 42 with record deficits at the time, deficits we'd trade for today in a nanosecond. So what did 42 do about it? Did PWJC lead the charge to pay down that deficit with the "Peace Dividend"? No, the debate at the time was "what do we spend it on?!" So no points for or against PWJC there.

              Note most of the conversation is about GHWB, not so much over JWC.  That sort of points to mediocre. Which one rates ahead of the other? Ask again in 20-30 years. But don't be surprised if the answer comes back GHWB.

              •  even if you think the war needed to be fought (0+ / 0-)

                he missed a golden opportunity to use it to begin a national conversation about energy policy. but his energy policies were no better than his son's. and don't forget that after the war, he encouraged uprisings against saddam, fooling the opposition into thinking he'd at least protect them, then allowed them to be massacred.

                keep in mind that bush handed clinton the balkan crisis, about which he did nothing, and the somalia crisis. he reassured deng after tiananmen. and he did nothing about the fall of the iron curtain- there was nothing he could have done, one way or the other. and the iran-contra pardons weren't about his past, they were to prevent his being implicated in the then still ongoing investigations.

                and there was good reason for the clinton campaign's famous internal theme about the economy.

                what historians say in 20-30 years will depend on who is writing the history. we know what they've done for reagan.

                The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

                by Laurence Lewis on Sun Jul 21, 2013 at 07:50:16 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

          •  Masterful diplomacy? (5+ / 0-)

            Uh, are you forgetting about April Glaspie giving Saddam Hussein the green light to invade Kuwait in the first place?

            Doesn't sound like masterful diplomacy to me.

            •  well, it was, actually, in that (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              gffish

              GHW Bush probably wanted Saddam to attack Kuwait.  Which gave him an easy opportunity to become a War President . . . an opportunity he botched, just as he botched most everything else.

              You remember the old joke, don't you?

              Q. Why is Babs always on top when Poppy and Babs have sex?
              A. Because Poppy can only f*** up.

              Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

              by corvo on Sun Jul 21, 2013 at 06:15:50 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Yes because everything evil is a USA conspiracy (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                FG, sebastianguy99

                F-sharp yesterday, today, and tomorrow.

                •  Nice to see you sticking up for Poppy. :-) (0+ / 0-)

                  btw F-sharp is a nice key.  Just ask Haydn, or Miaskovsky.

                  Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

                  by corvo on Sun Jul 21, 2013 at 06:26:00 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I know it is a key (0+ / 0-)

                    But I bow to your knowledge of who is known for writing in it.

                    I've heard most all of Jethro Tull music is in the key of G. With that, I am out of key ammo.

                    •  Well, there's Mahler too, (0+ / 0-)

                      but I'm no longer a precocious adolescent, so: meh.

                      Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

                      by corvo on Sun Jul 21, 2013 at 06:53:10 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  As with the key of F-sharp (0+ / 0-)

                        I know Maher's music exists, but that's about all.

                        I do like a spot of Ludwig von when I'm at the milk bar though I could not tell you the key.

                        •  Any droogie can tell you (1+ / 0-)
                          Recommended by:
                          WB Reeves

                          it's Ludwig VAN.

                          Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

                          by corvo on Sun Jul 21, 2013 at 07:39:02 PM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

            •  Sounds like the Ambassador fucked up to me (0+ / 0-)

              Show me the first fuckup-free national leadership. Any nation, and year. Now ...How how did the reaction to that error go?

              In closing, I am not suggesting GHWB be rated ahead of Adam in his pre-apple tasting days. I am suggesting POTUS 41 might well be rated ahead of POTUS 42 when teh historians are in position to start making that call.

            •  Juan Cole on April Glaspie (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              FG

              My thought is Amb Glaspie did a bad job in carring out her instuctions.  Juan Cole goes a step further and opinies that Amb Glaspie did not commit the act you accuse her of doing.

              In a bit of irony, he bases that statement on a cable released by Wikileaks. (The link in the Cole essay is disabled though.)

              Bottom line: Yes, masterful diplomacy.

              Global support including dozens of nations contributing troops (including Syria) vs "Coalition of the Willing" w/US, British, and about 400 Australians.

              No contest.

        •  May? MAY? (0+ / 0-)

          If Obama doesn't start working HARD on the issues he was elected to work on...he'll be lucky to make 50%.

          Like he has been stuck on for YEARS NOW. And how many of the Americans in that 50% are knee-jerk approvers who refuse to see the lack of results? Millions. If only you folks were willing to put a little pressure on him...especially last summer.

          But Obama was going to win no matter what. Every Democrat will win the Presidency for the time being, as long as the Teabaggers haven't died off. Americans know from crazy.

          What we need, what we've always needed, is more and BETTER DEMOCRATS. It's time for THAT to be the anthem, the rallying cry of our Party, not polishing the knobs of the likes of corporate suits like Obama.

          "I feel a lot safer already."--Emil Sitka

          by DaddyO on Mon Jul 22, 2013 at 07:25:17 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  Oh, we can't have THAT (0+ / 0-)

      When I remember the slings and arrows we slung at the Worst President Ever, for his myriad and endless crimes, I recall a LOT of persona sting being involved.

      But not OUR guy. Not the first African American President. It just isn't done on 'liberal' blogs. Can't have that.

      Fuck that noise. dance you monster has hit the nail on the head and driven it home with a single shot: "He just came along when we desperately needed one of the best..."

      And he failed us all miserably. But...he's sure having a good time. And so are his supporters who refuse to see reality.

      Sequester, anyone? Unemployment? Stimulus? "It's the economy, stupid"? If there were a Republican moderate or even liberal, he'd have my vote in a heartbeat over this jackass.

      And, yes, I VOTED FOR HIM TWICE, which gives me every right to critique his Presidency. You can't polish a turd. Bush tried.

      "I feel a lot safer already."--Emil Sitka

      by DaddyO on Mon Jul 22, 2013 at 07:16:17 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  If you feel the need to to engage (0+ / 0-)

        in personal vilification, there's no one to stop you. Just don't confuse that with actually accomplishing anything.

        Nothing human is alien to me.

        by WB Reeves on Mon Jul 22, 2013 at 10:10:27 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site