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View Diary: Under 300 Unique Phone Metadata Searches in 2012 (43 comments)

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  •  How do you think they've ... (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Hey338Too, BenderRodriguez, JoanMar

    ... been doing it for decades and decades? Think about it for one minute. What they did for decades and decades was to hold these hearings in secret, off the record, with everyone removed from the courtroom or with just the lawyers in chambers. Do you think that you're gonna be able to sit in on a Judge issuing a court order about red-hot CIA information related to a terrorist event planned to go down in the next couple of weeks? It has always been secret, and it will always be secret.  

    By the way, we know what the law says. Look at the diary. There are cases cited. The government has to abide by those cases and the constitutional standards and tests contained in them. Smith v. Maryland, 442 U.S. 735 (1979) is not secret. In fact, those numbers at the end tell you what volume of the book and what page in the book to find the case.

    I would tip you, but the man took away my tips.

    by Tortmaster on Tue Jul 23, 2013 at 07:49:39 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  We know what some of the laws say. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      CroneWit

      But, for instance, it used to be that people thought the Patriot Act allowed for collection of business records relating to a particular terrorism investigation. Now we know that a secret court ruling allows the government to use that provision to grab records on everyone, all the time.

      Since the law is the way the court interprets it, and the interpretations made by the FISC are secret, the law is in effect a secret.

      The court isn't just saying “yes, I see your evidence, you are authorized to surveil XYZ terrorists given the information here on their plans to bomb things.” Of course things like that happen in secret. They happen in regular courts, all the time.

      The objectionable rulings issued by the court here run more along the lines of “yes, you do have the power to run this program.” FISC rulings apparently go well beyond individual cases and in fact operate as controlling opinions — a body of case law that never sees Supreme Court scrutiny or any other scrutiny until someone takes it upon themselves to start leaking secret documents to the press.

      Code Monkey like freedom / Code Monkey like peace and justice too
      Code Monkey very nerdy man / With big warm fuzzy bleeding heart
      Code Monkey like you!

      Formerly known as Jyrinx.

      by Code Monkey on Tue Jul 23, 2013 at 07:59:29 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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