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View Diary: Don Lemon says Bill O'Reilly didn't go far Enough? (97 comments)

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  •  Dressing like that doesn't say ... (0+ / 0-)

    "I don't care what you think", IMO.  It actually says, "I'm deliberately trying to be offensive, and there's nothing you can do about it."  And what it means is:  "I'm an attention-seeker.  Look at me!"

    That's the way I interpret it, anyway.  

    However, there is something that can be done about it:  rejection by shunning.  It's not guaranteed to change their behavior, but at least I don't have to look at it, much less reward it and encourage its continuance by commenting on it to their faces.

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity, and I am not sure about the universe." -- Albert Einstein

    by Neuroptimalian on Sun Jul 28, 2013 at 12:29:39 PM PDT

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    •  You react with anger and rejection. (0+ / 0-)

      Even an impulse to shun! Those are strong negative emotions.

      The I "Don't Give a FUCK what you think" is actually stronger and more intentional than "I don't care what you think" More anger. More pissing on boundaries.  And as for the fashion aspect, more commercialization.

      I have no anger or impulse to avoid.  

      I just think Lemon's commentary is as valid as the fact that it wouldn't have made Trayvon Martin or Oscar Grant any safer or the next young black men killed. Culture is complicated and made more complicated by history and way more when there's a buck to be made whether it's CNN or Don Lemon or Jay-Z.

      •  Well, I was using nice words, (0+ / 0-)

        but yes, the fashion rebel's message is loud and strong.  In extreme cases, it's also obviously intended to provoke in order to gain attention, but there's no reason to buy into it, much less encourage its repetition by rewarding it with confrontation.  Rejection by shunning (walking away) accomplishes the opposite of rewarding negative behavior.

        "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity, and I am not sure about the universe." -- Albert Einstein

        by Neuroptimalian on Sun Jul 28, 2013 at 02:17:43 PM PDT

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    •  I think it is a way to say something (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Vyan, a2nite

      to people like you and all the people they have encountered that prejudge because of color, speech accent, gender, age and all other qualifiers.  It is saying I am going to do what you hate because you hate me.  I am going to fight the system that hates me this way because it is the only power I have, the power to annoy.  The feelings you have about a young person walking with hanging pants is outrageous to the point of silly.  Is it really that important that you have such a strong emotional reaction?  Kids rarely go to interviews or show up at important events with these clothes on.   When they care about something they dress appropriately.  When do I get to hear about the scantily dressed teenaged white girls at the mall?  You know, the ones that look like they are street walking?  Will the paper begin to print ltes on that subject?

      Everyone! Arms akimbo! 68351

      by tobendaro on Sun Jul 28, 2013 at 01:32:52 PM PDT

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      •  If that's the case, how do such people ... (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Vyan

        not understand that they're doing the very thing they think they're protesting?  Prejudging their audience makes them just as guilty of the very offense they presume they're rebelling against, without even knowing yet what their audience actually thinks.  It's like saying, "I presume you hate me, so let me make sure that I first let you know that I hate you!"  Sheesh!  If that's not the epitome of hypocrisy, what is?

        And to be clear, I'm not thinking of any particular age or race or fashion.  People of all stripes engage in this sort of idiocy.  

        "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity, and I am not sure about the universe." -- Albert Einstein

        by Neuroptimalian on Sun Jul 28, 2013 at 02:33:35 PM PDT

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        •  Do you expect children (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          a2nite

          to be able to reason as you just did? Because mostly the people with pants hanging where I live are teenagers.  Even the older ones that saunter across the street in front of me making me brake to allow them to pass are young adults at best and if a person has grown up with people calling them the n word to their faces and people talking them down constantly would you expect them to set aside their angst and emotions to reason things out?  I didn't become that way until well into adulthood.  I still lose it occasionally.  These are angry people, damaged by the system, by racism and prejudice.  Kindness and help is what they need.  I do not blame them a bit for getting their two cents in.

          Everyone! Arms akimbo! 68351

          by tobendaro on Sun Jul 28, 2013 at 02:47:51 PM PDT

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        •  I think they understand intuitively (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Neuroptimalian, a2nite, tobendaro

          that they have a right to express themselves whether you like it, approve it or not. It's your choice to be offended or blow it off, not theirs.

          •  Of course they have the right ... (0+ / 0-)

            to express themselves.  It's those who do so solely to provoke something negative in others that I'm referring to, thinking that if it's their desire to provoke disgust (or whatever), they shouldn't complain when they achieve it, nor should they be bewildered when it provokes a counter-response in their audiences.

            "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity, and I am not sure about the universe." -- Albert Einstein

            by Neuroptimalian on Sun Jul 28, 2013 at 07:27:06 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

    •  It also says.... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      a2nite

      "if you're Offended by what I'm wearing - You Deserve to be."     I learned that from Punk Rockers, if they clothes pins and green spiked hear got to you, you were a jerk as far as they were concerned - if you could hang with it, they were cool with you. I don't think they were wrong.

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