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View Diary: Nicholas Kristof asks "Can We See Our Hypocrisy to Animals?" (99 comments)

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  •  So what about plants? They are alive too. (2+ / 0-)
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    elmo, Hannibal

    And no, I'm not trying to be facetious. It just seems to me that there is no consensus as to which life is apparently expendable. In some cultures insects are thought to have value as well but in the West there is no movement to uphold their rights.

    Where is the line drawn and what are the acceptable justifications for those boundaries? I do not see how this can be a completely morally-complete discussion without answering some very tough questions about all lifeforms.

    I guess I just do not have high hopes given that human beings are animals that are unable to end the neglect, abuse, and slaughter of their own species.

    The politicians may be bought, and the system corrupt, but it is our duty to fix these things.

    by sebastianguy99 on Sun Jul 28, 2013 at 12:51:51 PM PDT

    •  In Jewish law, for meat to be kosher (7+ / 0-)

      the animal must have been well treated during its life and killed swiftly, without suffering.

      I think those are very good precepts.

      •  Strictly speaking (2+ / 0-)
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        RainDog2, Eowyn9

        the part about "the animal must have been well treated during its life" is the spirit of the law, not the letter.  There is a law against causing pain to living animals, but it is distinct from the laws about humane slaughtering of food animals and as such does not directly impact whether the slaughtered animal's meat is kosher.

        However, it can indirectly impact it, in that the meat is not kosher if the animal has sustained certain types of lasting injuries during its life, or if it has certain types of illnesses when it is killed.

    •  Different cultures have different values (1+ / 0-)
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      sebastianguy99

      Hindus won't eat cows, jews and muslims won't eat pork, Buddhists won't eat meat. The most extreme though are the Jainists, who won't even eat root vegetables.

      First they came for the farm workers, and I said nothing.

      by Hannibal on Sun Jul 28, 2013 at 07:34:17 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Where would you draw the line? (1+ / 0-)
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      sebastianguy99

      I think that's what Krisftof's column was all about. Should we give animals greater consideration than we do? Is it moral to treat them as we do? Do you think that plants and insects should have rights as well? It's not necessarily what I believe, but I'm willing to hear you out if you can make a rational case for it.

      "If the machine of government is of such a nature that it requires you to be the agent of injustice to another, then, I say, break the law." - Henry David Thoreau

      by Jason Hackman on Mon Jul 29, 2013 at 06:16:10 AM PDT

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      •  Yes, exactly what I was asking. (0+ / 0-)

        I think there is more to the moral and spiritual discussion than "animal rights". Too many people seem disinclined to engage in discussion beyond animals.

        The politicians may be bought, and the system corrupt, but it is our duty to fix these things.

        by sebastianguy99 on Mon Jul 29, 2013 at 11:02:05 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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