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View Diary: Administration Attempt to Manage Fallout Over the NSA Review Panel (286 comments)

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  •  The Onion Is Closing (15+ / 0-)

    They have concluded that satire cannot be as absurd as reality.

    Someone should encourage the administration key members to read "The Unmaking of the President".

    And then remind them that (i) Joe Biden is sharper that President Ford, and (ii) Even if you disagree with (i), he will have the outcome of the Ford re-election campaign after Fords two pardons before him.

    Mind you, I do not think that history will recycle itself, but we have more than 9000 Snowden documents to go.

    9000 documents on the wall,
    yes 9000 on the wall

    and repeat...old drinking song.

    However, on past occasions when one party did unfortunate things (Hoover, Nixon and Watergate, Bush A and taxes), the other party had been the opposition, so it collected election victories (FDR, Carter, Clinton) while the good people in the de-elected party for better or worse got their acts together (Eisenhower, Reagan, W. Bush).

    This time, the establishment of the opposition is vigorously in favor of the unfortunate events now unfolding.  The closest I recall historically to a both-party crackup was 1850-1860.

    Restore the Fourth! Save America!

    by phillies on Tue Aug 13, 2013 at 03:27:19 PM PDT

    •  Result of 1850-1860 was a new ruling party. (5+ / 0-)

      Who can do that for us now?

      The influence of the [executive] has increased, is increasing, and ought to be diminished.

      by lysias on Tue Aug 13, 2013 at 03:53:14 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  They have already created a third party for us... (5+ / 0-)

        called the tea party.  If you don't like the two choices they gave you before, you certainly won't like the third one.  How about a fourth choice?  

        The Klu Klux Klan may have a candidate available.  It is the ONLY way they could get more right wing than they currently are.  

        Maybe then they can finally start calling Ann Coulter a bleeding heart liberal and the ever right shifting middle will be somewhere around Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity.

        "Perhaps the sentiments contained in the following pages, are not YET sufficiently fashionable to procure them general favour..."

        by Buckeye Nut Schell on Tue Aug 13, 2013 at 04:22:25 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  We have three actual third parties (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          hoplite9, Buckeye Nut Schell


          They all have positions.  The 1845-1860 history suggests these will come and go and something else will come out.

          The Tea Party people are going to fight for possession of the Republican ships of dreams,ummh, nightmares.

          Restore the Fourth! Save America!

          by phillies on Tue Aug 13, 2013 at 08:16:53 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Remember thelesson of the Whigs (10+ / 0-)

        When a major American party has no cogent position on the great issues of the time; when that same party trumpets "compromises" that give most of the benefits to the other side as its great triumphs; when its electoral reason for being boils down to "we're not the other guys", that party can be swept away in the twinkling of an eye.  Just as what happened to the Whigs.  It wasn't the extremist Democratic Party that pushed the nation into secession and brutal civil war that disappeared.  It was the great Party of Comprmise that vanished virtually overnight.

        The same thing can still happen.  In the era of electronic telecommunications (and their monitoring) it may be more difficult than in the early days of the telegraph, because we didn't have universal predigested preapproved ideas and opinions foisted on us nationally and simultaneously, but on the other hand, most of us aren't working 14 hours a day any more either.

        Clap On, Clap Off, The Clapper!

        by ActivistGuy on Tue Aug 13, 2013 at 05:36:52 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I urge readers (5+ / 0-)

          To read David Potter's historical works, notably The Impending Crisis and Lincoln and His Party In The Secession Crisis.

          Both parties really did have a cogent position on the slavery issue, the same cogent position that moderners find so hard to understand, namely that NOTHING was more important than preserving the Union and secondary issues like slavery had to be put to the side.  That lasted until the Republicans and their antecedents came along -- at least one Buchanan biographer argues that Buchanan single-handedly saved the Republicans from fragmentation through brilliantly bad decisions -- and we got a regional resorting of Democrats and Republicans.  Once the parties became regional -- modern readers may find this familiar -- the slavery issue became primary for both parties.

          Potter's case is that the two aprties blundered into civil war, the southerners because they believe ina  boogieman Lincoln whose policies were not Lincoln's, and the Republicans, who were absolutely totally positive that the southerners were bluffing and southern unionism would carry the day, as had already happened when VA and NC massively rejected secession.

          Alas, SC hotheads and lack of adequate provisions in Fort Sumter resulted in war.

          IMHO, the modern issue matching slavery is enslaving women through restricted abortion access.  The issue is driving regional partitioning of the parties.

          Restore the Fourth! Save America!

          by phillies on Tue Aug 13, 2013 at 08:25:49 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Re: The Impending Crisis... (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:

            Good comment about Lincoln--I definitely intend to check out the Potter book.  Have some disagreement with your last paragraph:

            IMHO, the modern issue matching slavery is enslaving women through restricted abortion access.  The issue is driving regional partitioning of the parties.
            Yes, the war against women is making for a lot of sound and fury.  But, I feel it is really a diversionary issue, designed to keep us away from the really important one, which is the economic dominance of the 1 percent and the economic screwing of the middle and lower classes.  Slavery was, at heart, an economic issue too--the Southern economy was built around slave labor.  Politics, in essence, is about who gets what, with a bunch of subsidiary issues circling around that main one and used tactically at any given moment.

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