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View Diary: An unhappy 60th birthday: The CIA coup of 1953 still resonates in Iran. Operation Ajax remembered (130 comments)

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  •  thanks for the retelling of this story (32+ / 0-)

    the US has been doing these things for decades

    but the US population does not know, and probably does not care

    we did this in Latin America as you noted in your article

    the issues with Iran didn't just happen recently

    and in the last years of the Bush administration they came close to invading Iran

    since it has 3 times as many people as Iraq, that would have been another nightmare to occupy the country

    all done in the name of oil and Israel and Saudi Arabia, but hidden under the undefined term "terrorism"

    •  US lacked the resources to occupy Iran (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Don midwest

      our military was seriously over-committed and we could count on few allies for boots on the ground.  Reality finally asserted itself when the winger warhawks got ready to go for Iran

    •  Unlike, say the Soviet Union, which merely (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      hmi

      rolled tanks into Eastern Europe, etc.

      LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

      by dinotrac on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 05:56:35 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  So - we're better than them? Yaay Team! (3+ / 0-)

        Thank god for low expectations, right?


        The Fail will continue until actual torches and pitchforks are set in motion. - Pangolin@kunstler.com

        by No one gets out alive on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 07:00:26 PM PDT

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        •  Actually, yes, but that's not a very high bar. (0+ / 0-)

          There is a tendency to single out the US as if we were unique in the horrors of our history.

          It just ain't so.

          LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

          by dinotrac on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 09:08:41 PM PDT

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          •  Please tell me you're not invoking... (6+ / 0-)

            ...Kirkpatrick's "blame America first" BS. Pointing out America's bloody hubris does not mean ignoring what other nation-states have done.

            Of course, I could inject the-Soviets-rolled-tanks and the Japanese-raped-Nanking and the Romans salted-the-ground-at-Carthage in each critique of U.S. foreign policy to ensure that it's never forgotten that everybody-does-it. But the point is that everybody-doesn't-do-it with my tax money.

            Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

            by Meteor Blades on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 11:51:56 PM PDT

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            •  And if we're going to proclaim ourselves the (3+ / 0-)

              country of "liberty and justice" for all, we should actually want the same thing for other countries, even if that means our oil companies lose a little profit.

              Freedom has two enemies: Those who want to control everyone around them...and those who feel no need to control themselves.

              by Sirenus on Mon Aug 19, 2013 at 05:54:08 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  No, but I am saying the same thing. (3+ / 0-)

              Whether you like it or not, it is a favorite pastime of progressives.

              Everybody does it is no more a justification than it is for tax cheats or for my kids.

              Doing it with my tax money is just as offensive to me as it doing it with your tax money is to you.

              As the child of an Air Force pilot who died in service and is buried at Arlington, and somebody who had reason to spend time around Walter Reed during the Vietnam War, tax money is the least of my concerns.  Adventurism tends to get Americans killed. Worse, it tends to get some of the best young Americans killed -- those with a strong sense of duty and the willingness to follow through.

              Those young people are far more valuable than our tax dollars. Far too valuable to spend carelessly.

              Whether or not you blame American first.

              LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

              by dinotrac on Mon Aug 19, 2013 at 08:29:50 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  I am confused by your stance... (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                onionjim

                ...You're saying the U.S. isn't exceptional in having horrors in its history (and I agree) but that progressives don't take that into account (I disagree) but that the U.S. shouldn't engage in actions like Vietnam and coups?

                Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

                by Meteor Blades on Mon Aug 19, 2013 at 09:11:24 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Why is that confusing? (0+ / 0-)

                  Sounds like we have one point of disagreement:

                  That Progressives tend to treat America as some uniquely horrible actor.

                  I can live with that disagreement. Reasonable people can disagree on many things.

                  To be clear, I don't use the word "all", and am not sure I would use the word "most", given a lack of empirical evidence and the squeaky-wheel syndrom.  Maybe "too many" is the best qualifier.

                  LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

                  by dinotrac on Mon Aug 19, 2013 at 09:17:17 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Your initial comment seemed to me a backhanded... (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    onionjim

                    ...support for the coup since along the lines of everybody-does-it. But this follow-up comment seemed to partly cut against that.

                    Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

                    by Meteor Blades on Mon Aug 19, 2013 at 09:19:41 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  Oh -- in that case, no. (2+ / 0-)

                      Egypt is for Egyptians to handle.

                      It's a very tricky situation for the United States because we have such a history of aid to and interaction with the Egyptian military.

                      I pray that it doesn't turn into full-scale genocide because part of me isn't very comfortable with my usual hands-off outlook when it comes to mass killings of civilians.

                      Still -- we didn't take out Saddam Hussein when he was killing tens of thousands of his own people, so the bar must be pretty high.

                      LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

                      by dinotrac on Mon Aug 19, 2013 at 09:25:06 AM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

    •  If we ever invaded Iran, it would be WW3 (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Don midwest

      Nuclear war possibly. Russia and China have MAJOR deals with Iran for oil & trade & they would team up to prevent us from messing around with that. They tolerated the invasion of Iraq but wouldn't sit still for an attack on Iran. At least that's what I'm led to understand from what I've read of Scott Ritter and others who are more well informed on this than I am.

      A village can not reorganize village life to suit the village idiot.

      by METAL TREK on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 08:09:35 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  You didn't mention Africa. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      claude, mkor7

      Ike didn't like Patrice Lamumba and our interference in the Congo was pretty reprehensible.

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