Skip to main content

View Diary: RKBA: Open Thread (320 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  I use the word "training," by the way, to refer to (4+ / 0-)

    my residency, which I did in Philadelphia. I use the word "education" to refer to the preceding 20 years, all in Iowa.

    -7.25, -6.26

    We are men of action; lies do not become us.

    by ER Doc on Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 07:38:44 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •   This is called Self-Awareness (0+ / 0-)

      Its a Progressive idea. We feel certain ways when we are growing up, and its possible to get stuck in a time period of feeling out of nostalgia, desire for certainty, or a feeling of power we thought we needed. Gun owners, and I am one of those who felt this way at 14, wrap themslves in these deep feelings and then construct elaborate rational arguments for why it is right and natural to do so. The NRA is paid to do this psychological work for you.

      But when you become self-aware, you understand that a feeling is not a good enough reason to cling so tightly to an idea which is proving really harmful when spread out among the fearful population. Still, your "reasons" remain. The feeling comes first, the reasons, the rationalizations, second.

      That is what, you, ER Doctor do not understand. You think your Reasons are all you need. You do not get the basic human principle, a fact, that we all reason from emotion first, and that a self-aware person admits this, and puts it into the rhetorical equation. Ethos, Logos, Pathos.. two of the three are feelings, not fact. Aristotle put Ethics first, Logos second and Pathos third for a reason in his formulation of what is correct argumentation and correct thinking about human issues. He was, and is, largely correct on this I think, and so do many Progressive Humanists.

      Time to start changing your feelings as you did on the issue of seat belts, food additives, soil conservation, regulation of ER doctors qualifications, etc etc etc. . You, and I,  didnt like someone telling you what to do for your own good, but eventually you, and I, realized it was right. This is mature self awareness. This is the same thing. You have the intelligence to become self aware and join the moral side, the side which will win this debate and the policy which will follow as soon as Scalia and Alito and Roberts are gone from the bench by way of humiliating retirement.

      I have this quote line for a good reason, from one of the true geniuses of America: "Figures don't lie, but liars do figure"-Mark Twain

      Facts are not enough, especially cherry picked facts from a self interested source, the NRA. Progressives know this in their bones, and people who are trained technocrats or drilled in the virtue of "proceedure" have real trouble with the concept. I appeal to the RKBA to take this into real consideration when examining where your beliefs come from, and their consequences for the innocent children exposed to an extreme threat of the gun in America.

      Figures don't lie, but liars do figure-Mark Twain

      by OregonOak on Wed Aug 21, 2013 at 08:26:38 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  THINK OF THE CHILDREN. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        theatre goon, ER Doc

        Yep, no appeal to emotion there...

        Republicans cause more damage than guns ever will. Share Our Wealth

        by KVoimakas on Wed Aug 21, 2013 at 09:44:58 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  My Right Wing teacher friend uses this as his (0+ / 0-)

          battle cry. Implying, of course, that empathy is weak, inferior, not to be tolerated by Real Romans. Manly Men. Good to mock concern for the underdog. He is one of those frat boys who never got over being a white guy when being a white guy was not cool any more. The 1990s. He is armed too..

          Figures don't lie, but liars do figure-Mark Twain

          by OregonOak on Wed Aug 21, 2013 at 12:01:53 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  The appeal to emotion: (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            ER Doc

            for those who can't argue with facts.

            Republicans cause more damage than guns ever will. Share Our Wealth

            by KVoimakas on Wed Aug 21, 2013 at 12:13:03 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Its an example.. and its a fact. Logos. (0+ / 0-)

              I know all this because I have talked to him at length. He is a seriously conflicted and frustrated guy because he feels he missed out on all the easy pickings as a white guy by being born too late. Its sad.. I dont know how he got that idea, but its FIRMLY planted in his head, along with the mocking battle cry.. THINK of the CHILDREN.. He thinks its clever.

              Figures don't lie, but liars do figure-Mark Twain

              by OregonOak on Wed Aug 21, 2013 at 02:24:37 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site