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View Diary: Fear and Self-loathing in post-Bush America: The natural disrepair of a skeptical society (20 comments)

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  •  Guilt-tripping, here: "To think otherwise - (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    voroki
    or, worse yet, to accept such premises as unconditionally superior to any and all capacities of intervention - is as willfully naïve as believing that the NSA is only scanning "metadata" from your personal information.
    So being opposed to starting our next (4th) Middle Eastern War is equal to accepting NSA assurances at face value?

    Calling b.s. on this fatuous rationalizing.

    "A popular government without popular information, or the means of acquiring it, is but a prologue to a farce or a tragedy, or perhaps both." - James Madison, 1822

    by Superskepticalman on Tue Aug 27, 2013 at 03:53:24 AM PDT

    •  How long have Obama's critics (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      BigRedBlackGuy

      been howling about Obama "doing nothing!" about Syria?

      Does it appear to you that the Obama administration has just been pretending all this time that it does not want to get involved in this conflict?

      To compare what's going on now to the Bush Administration starting a war in a country that was then at peace is ridiculous.

      And, by the way, our "war" in Libya (if you're counting that as being in the Middle East) turned out fairly well I'd say.

    •  I think it is quite a grave falsehood (0+ / 0-)

      To draw a direct equivalence between the Bush Administration's trigger happiness to start a conflict in Iraq versus Obama's demonstrated reluctance to do anything on this matter. Are there parallels? Yes. Is a false flag possible? Absolutely.

      But the context is completely, entirely different.

      Also, if you're going to quote me, quote me in context; because the preface to what you quoted was:

      This war is not going away, and this war is not going to resolve itself.

      Someone will tip the scales. If you are a unilateral noninterventionist, the necessary consequence of your philosophy is a quiet reconciliation to whomever that someone may be as well as an acceptance of the aftermath of the fashion in which said scales are tipped.

      No one anywhere thinks this war is going to be resolved in the near future, tidily or otherwise.

      I am challenging the absolute and unflinching moral superiority of unilateral nonintervention that is pervading so many progressive circles right now. I am not in favor of intervention now. I probably will not be in favor of intervention later. But nonintervention has consequences just as intervention has consequences, and the consequences of nonintervention have the capacity to be worse.

      That is not the same as beating the war drum and saying that not getting involved will make us worse off. It merely has the capacity to. I am glad to live under an administration in which nonintervention is more of a default response than intervention (which was the case in the Bush years).

      The opposition is comprised of myriad radical elements, and Russia and Iran are significant chess pieces on this board. This situation exists in far less of a vacuum than Iraq. I spoke to this sentiment earlier in my post, saying

      the unwillingness of a nation or nations to make a tough decision between unpalatable options in the present often leads to the making of an impossible decision between unconscionable options in the future.
      We kicked the can down the road on this issue last year. Now we're in a worse spot. That is not me calling for war. That is a simple, objective analysis of facts. We did not act when things were not as bad. Now we may not act when things are worse. We still may not act in the future even when things deteriorate further.

      And that is acceptable, so long as you understand that these are consequences - however indirect - of inaction.

      "I hear you talk, but I don't hear you speak" - Sum 41

      by BigRedBlackGuy on Tue Aug 27, 2013 at 03:03:00 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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