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View Diary: Was Lincoln Wrong to Fight to Preserve the Union? (68 comments)

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  •  Likely true (0+ / 0-)

    However, it was long and bloody. So that hypothetical doesn't matter.

    Time is of no account with great thoughts, which are as fresh to-day as when they first passed through their authors' minds ages ago. - Samuel Smiles

    by moviemeister76 on Wed Sep 11, 2013 at 09:19:01 AM PDT

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    •  just pointing out (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Judgment at Nuremberg, ichibon

      that emanciption was not the Northern goal for the war. Preserving the Union was. Emancipation of Southern slaves was a tactic towards that goal.

      Ending slavery everywhere was only barely possible in 1865 as the Southern States were not involved in the ammendment process.

      •  I know that (2+ / 0-)
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        TomP, ichibon

        I already wrote that in another comment. Hell, Lincoln was willing to pass an amendment making slavery explicitly legal.

        Time is of no account with great thoughts, which are as fresh to-day as when they first passed through their authors' minds ages ago. - Samuel Smiles

        by moviemeister76 on Wed Sep 11, 2013 at 09:27:54 AM PDT

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      •  I posit that each was a goal of the other. (4+ / 0-)

        Although he may have started out as a racist -- a view which he apparently moderated significantly over time -- it's also clear that Lincoln hated slavery with a passion. Hated it for the evil that it was. And Lincoln knew that there was absolutely nothing he could do about it unless the slave states stayed in the Union.

        Remember, he didn't need the 13th Amendment to win the war. The Emancipation Proclamation provided all the strategic benefit that there was to be gained from freeing the slaves. He wanted the 13th Amendment because he felt a moral obligation to preclude any possibility of the freed slaves being forced back into slavery.

        The Civil War was fought to free the slaves. And the slaves were freed to win the Civil War. The two cannot be so easily separated.

        Let us all have the strength to see the humanity in our enemies, and the courage to let them see the humanity in ourselves.

        by Nowhere Man on Wed Sep 11, 2013 at 10:43:05 AM PDT

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    •  Not very long (1+ / 0-)
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      moviemeister76

      1861 to 1865. The Thirty Years' War, a German civil war, ran from 1618 to 1648.

      Censorship is rogue government.

      by scott5js on Wed Sep 11, 2013 at 12:38:45 PM PDT

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      •  Perspective I suppose (1+ / 0-)
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        scott5js

        Many of the people who started the war assumed it would be over in a few months. The fact that it took much longer, comparatively speaking, is likely what led to many of them thinking it was a long, drawn out war.

        Time is of no account with great thoughts, which are as fresh to-day as when they first passed through their authors' minds ages ago. - Samuel Smiles

        by moviemeister76 on Wed Sep 11, 2013 at 12:54:46 PM PDT

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