Skip to main content

View Diary: Who Wrote Putin's Op-Ed? (50 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  Clearly that notion got combined (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ukit, koNko

    with Marxism under Lenin and Stalin. They definitely had the intention of imposing their ideology on the entire world. It was an undesirable goal when they wanted to do it and I think it is also undesirable when pursued by the US.

    If this were coming solely from Valdamir Putin it would be one thing. However, he is articulating a view that is held by much of the rest of the world.

    •  It goes back to the medieval period, (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Garrett

      and was revived in the last decade as a political slogan.  I gave a pretty extensive outline of this in a previous diary, if you're interested.  Suffice to say that Putin is trolling us.

      Point being - yes, a lot of people agree with it, but if Obama had penned an op-ed against nations acting unilaterally... I mean, we'd laugh about that, right?  Even though we agree with the premise?  We should be able to do both?

      Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

      by pico on Thu Sep 12, 2013 at 11:20:56 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I read your diary and participated in the (0+ / 0-)

        discussion.

        Point being - yes, a lot of people agree with it, but if Obama had penned an op-ed against nations acting unilaterally... I mean, we'd laugh about that, right?  Even though we agree with the premise?  We should be able to do both?
        I'm not sure I follow the point you are making here.
        •  Rebut to: (0+ / 0-)
          If this were coming solely from Valdamir Putin it would be one thing. However, he is articulating a view that is held by much of the rest of the world.
          Switch out Putin and exceptionalism with Obama and unilateral military force.
          I mean, we'd laugh about that, right?  Even though we agree with the premise?  We should be able to do both?

          Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

          by pico on Thu Sep 12, 2013 at 11:37:10 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Isn't that kind of what this column was, though - (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Richard Lyon

        an argument against nations acting unilaterally? Whatever its past traditions might be, Russia is not disregarding U.N. decisions and invading countries in violation of international law. When they start doing that, then you can accuse them of trolling/hypocrisy.

        •  Except for Georgia they don't have the power to do (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          pico

          that. So they exert influence more covertly.

          You can't make this stuff up.

          by David54 on Thu Sep 12, 2013 at 12:14:13 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  They had boots on the ground in Georgia, (0+ / 0-)

          unilaterally, and fully disregarding the rest of the UN Security Council members on their treatment of the South Ossetian/Abkhazian issue.   Putin, who was the prime minister at the time, argued that Russian troops were necessary because Russia was in the process of extending a limited diplomatic recognition of the breakaway republics, disregarding Georgia's claim to sovereignty and the rest of the international community.

          I'm not even fully in disagreement with that because the Georgia situation was - and is - a big ol' mess, albeit of their own making.  So I can accuse Putin of trolling/hypocrisy just fine, thank you.

          Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

          by pico on Thu Sep 12, 2013 at 12:30:17 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  That's probably his version of the Monroe Doctrine (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            ukit, koNko

            I think he figures he's got the major power might makes right to mess around in his own neighborhood.  He doesn't think we have the right to aggressively mess around outside of our own neighborhood at least without some major power agreement on how we're all going to mess around.

            •  And everybody is trying (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              ukit, koNko

              to stake out territory in the Middle East.

            •  *sigh* This is why commenting on the internet (0+ / 0-)

              is so frustrating.

              Let's review this thread.  This is where we started:

              I'm still cracking up at the politician who made national exceptionalism into the basis of his political platform arguing that it's a bad thing for nations to engage in.  
              That turned into a disagreement about whether Russian exceptionalism has anything in common with American exceptionalism (it's worse, actually), then that didn't matter, because we were talking about exceptionalism as a justification for preemptive invasion outside of international law, and then that didn't matter, because we're talking about exceptionalism as a justification for preemptive invasion outside of international law but into nations that are outside one's presumed sphere of influence.  

              Do we want to add any more caveats, or can we go back to our sheep?  Just because Americans are pretty ignorant about how Russian exceptionalism works doesn't mean that Putin scores points for trolling us.  He's right that exceptionalism is bad.  He's also one of its main proponents at home, which makes him a hypocrite.  The end.

              Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

              by pico on Thu Sep 12, 2013 at 01:20:05 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

          •  Then also accuse him of consistency (0+ / 0-)

            It would be quite rare for Russia to abandon their basic doctrine of non-intervention in the UN.

            Note I said "in the UN".

            USA, on the other hand, tends to be inconsistent and present the appearance of being quite opportunistic.

            For example, in less than a week Obama has flipped 180 degrees in terms of the utility of the UN.

            Now if the subject was WMDs in Isreal or even chemical weapons in the USA (still have stockpiles) that would be a different case I suppose.

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

  • Recommended (123)
  • Community (60)
  • Elections (31)
  • Media (31)
  • Trans-Pacific Partnership (30)
  • 2016 (29)
  • Environment (27)
  • Law (26)
  • Barack Obama (24)
  • Culture (23)
  • Civil Rights (23)
  • Hillary Clinton (23)
  • Climate Change (21)
  • Science (21)
  • Republicans (21)
  • Economy (19)
  • Labor (19)
  • Josh Duggar (18)
  • Jeb Bush (18)
  • Bernie Sanders (16)
  • Click here for the mobile view of the site