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View Diary: Why i and Even Putin know Assad Used Chemical Weapons (88 comments)

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  •  no german intel has not (0+ / 0-)

    your twisting of the reports by german intel has.

    •  what part of (5+ / 0-)
      the head of the German Foreign Intelligence agency, Gerhard Schindler, last week told a select group of German lawmakers that intercepted communications had convinced German intelligence officials that Assad did not order or approve what is believed to be a sarin gas attack on Aug. 21
      do you not understand?

      The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

      by Laurence Lewis on Thu Sep 12, 2013 at 10:17:13 PM PDT

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      •  source that please (0+ / 0-)

        as the last time you provided a link there was a lot of context you skipped over

        •  i know this is hard (4+ / 0-)

          here's the context:

          The newspaper’s article said that on numerous occasions in recent months, the German intelligence ship named Oker, which is off the Syrian coast, has intercepted communications indicating that field officers have contacted the Syrian presidential palace seeking permission to use chemical weapons and have been turned down.

          The article added that German intelligence does not believe Assad sanctioned the alleged attack on August 21.

          The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

          by Laurence Lewis on Thu Sep 12, 2013 at 11:20:49 PM PDT

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          •  the only thing hard (0+ / 0-)

            is making sure your sources say what you think they say.

            Case in point, from the same source

            Last week, the German newsmagazine Der Spiegel, also citing a briefing for German legislators, said that the Oker had intercepted a phone call between a commander from the Lebanese militant group Hezbollah and an official at an unidentified Iranian embassy saying that Assad had ordered the Aug. 21 chemical attack out of anger. The Hezbollah commander called the attack a “huge mistake,” Der Spiegel said. It was not clear if the two news accounts were based on the same or different briefings
            Now I am not sure how both of these things can be true and this certainly suggests things are not as 'certain' as you have claimed.
            •  gosh (3+ / 0-)

              you figured that out all by yourself. german intel had hearsay evidence between a hezbollah commander and an unknown iranian official. and they had months of direct intercepts between commanders and the palace. and they were smart enough to figure out which was credible. what did the paper say german intel concluded? what did the paper say the head of german intel concluded? it's right there in the article.

              i know this is hard.

              The cold passion for truth hunts in no pack. -Robinson Jeffers

              by Laurence Lewis on Fri Sep 13, 2013 at 01:22:28 AM PDT

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              •  asdf (0+ / 0-)

                being arrogant and condescending  doesn't make you anything other then a bit of a jerk you know.

                Months of intercepts only prove that to that date Assad controlled himself and actually that makes it more likely that Assad did this in a fit of anger and rage then not.

                But please keep on beating that drum of yours as if the past means he didn't do it now. Did you even watch his interview? It was classic smug dictator 'I did it and you can't prove it so up yours'.

                And yet you keep carrying water for the guy and why? Because it embarrasses Obama?

                I really don't get you, you're obviously very smart and a hell of a writer. Much better then me for sure and yet you persist in letting your bias dominate your thinking.

      •  Is there any evidence that Assad has sacked (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        the commander responsible (his brother) or had any other reaction within the regime command communication system that he disapproved of the attack, etc.?
        It's possible that he tacitly approved of the attack even if he didn't explicitly communicate that.

        I'm not attacking people here for being opposed to the strikes or being "against war" (I am too.) however, I think it's embarrassing the degree to which people on the left are out to make a victim of Bashar Assad.

        Despicable also, is the maneuvering of Ted Cruz and Rand Paul who are looking to use "the anti-war left" as a cudgel to smack Obama around. Anybody who thinks this new "non-interventionism" exists for any reason other than to "say no to Obama" are fools.
        They of course are mounting a "pro-Putin/Assad" campaign targeting the religious right, touting Assad's protection of Christians, as well. Not only that, but if you haven't looked at the mainstream media lately, they're falling all over themselves in the mindless effort to "not repeat the drumbeat to war" CNN and the Morning Joe/Chuck Todd axis of MSNBC are entirely blaming everything on the Pres. and, of course, gop malfeasance and obstruction doesn't exist.

        My nephew, a gun-obsessed tea party whack job was just last week touting some 4th rate movie about the North Koreans being invited to the White House and taking hostages and taking over our gov. and how "we need our guns"Etc.
        Then Wed he's over here with the "It's good Putin's going to make Assad give up the CW. I'm so tired of war..." Bullshit. They all got the "say no to Obama" memo.

        Putin/Assad are looking to leverage the combined tea party "no to Obama on everything" and the left opposition into a victory for Assad.

        In this environment, I think people who want lasting peace should think twice about defending Assad. Furthermore, I think there will be more info coming out from multiple sources. I don't think we should be mounting a "save Assad" propaganda campaign just yet.

        Everybody knows there are "no good options" in Syria. Everyone knows that the presence of al Qaeda radically complicated efforts to mount a program to remove Assad from power. Everyone knows there are multiple groups and "everybody's fighting everyone else" . On top of this, you have the traitorous gop complicating our efforts to resolve this. Assad may not have specifically ordered the CW attacks. However he is the one in a position right now, (if anyone is) of securing the CW and seeing to its disposal. Pressure has to be brought on him</em>.

        I appreciate your effort to illuminate the facts so far, but the prevailing opinion of German intel doesn't constitute ironclad proof of anything.
        At any rate, it's good that the credible threat of action by the President convinced Putin to make this move, if it proves to be substantive. Something tells me he's just Stalin. (sorry, couldn't help it).

        Somehow, those of us on "the left" are going to have to find a somewhat unified path going forward. That doesn't mean we'll all agree. But these parsing, nitpicking, bickering threads here probably weaken us.

        You can't make this stuff up.

        by David54 on Fri Sep 13, 2013 at 08:18:44 AM PDT

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