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View Diary: Obamacare so in demand that sites are overwhelmed (173 comments)

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  •  I wonder how many people (6+ / 0-)

    trying to log on are like me, logging on to the exchanges to see what the cost will be not out of the alleged excitement and "demand," but out of curiosity.

    I plugged in all the numbers about age, income, location, and was given estimates from several insurance companies. With the tax credit my partner and I would have to pay 327 per month, with additional out of pocket expenses totaling 4000 per annum.  

    We already are drowning in debt we can't pay, and are still facing possible bankruptcy.

    We will probably apply for an exemption since paying this additional amount would certainly bankrupt us.

    Sorry, although my browsing the Oregon site made me one of thousands to overwhelm the site to the point of shutting down access, we can't be counted as among the excited people to whom you refer.

    "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

    by ZhenRen on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 11:41:05 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  I'm confused, if you don't have insurance (7+ / 0-)

      If you don't have health insurance right now what difference would the "out of pocket expenses" make to your health care purchases? You will simply bear the full cost of whatever procedures you need and if your costs go over the 4000 you won't be covered.  I hope you and your partner can find better rates, or be willing to accept a lower metal band so that you at least have some form of catastrophic insurance.  Try again later and/or contact your congressperson to see if there is something that can help you make this more affordable.

      •  The only reason to have insurance (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Willa Rogers, 4Freedom, kyril, mkor7

        is to use it. My partner has some serious medical issues at the moment, and we were hoping that getting affordable insurance would help our situation.

        We need insurance in order to, um, actually use it. Otherwise, we would just forget about getting insurance, since we can't afford it. We may have to just get her the medical care (surgery) and then file for bankruptcy to discharge the debt. Or, we could sign up for insurance, pay the premium for a month or two (long enough to get her into the system), get the surgery, and then stop paying. At the moment, we are on the edge of bankruptcy, and have been for the last year or two.

        Going into a hospital to get medical treatment without insurance will probably be a thing of the past, so after this all takes effect, we may have to use the latter plan. We simply can't afford to add thousands more per annum to our present debt load.

        It seems there are a lot of democrats who are financially comfortable enough to be completely oblivious to the words, "we cannot afford more debt". It's subconscious classism.

        It all sounds so easy when it isn't YOU facing the problem. Which is why I'm a socialist... capitalists are destroying the planet with this classist mentality.

        "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

        by ZhenRen on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 01:14:11 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Are you married? (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          CorinaR, kyril

          If not, then income should be based on each of you and your parnter's earnings separately, I think, and the insurance may be more affordable. (There's a bit of a "marriage penalty" built into the subsidies on the Exchanges.)

          I hear you, though: The out-of-pocket costs required under the  affordable and subsidized plans are way out of reach for most folks in lower-to-middle income brackets. The talking-point response is always about "free" birth control and "free" preventive care but some of the deets are ugly when it comes to cost-sharing under the subsidized plans.

          •  My partner makes the bulk of our income (0+ / 0-)

            Eliminating my income won't help much. And yes, we did explore this option you raise.

            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

            by ZhenRen on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 02:09:56 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Since your income is inconsiderable, you should (0+ / 0-)

              qualify for a substantial subsidy to pay for your health insurance.

              •  True (0+ / 0-)

                but my concern is not about myself (I'm in excellent health and always have been, but I do plan on getting into the new expanded medicaid), but about my partner. I guess you forgot about that part of my story, rather conveniently.

                Frankly, I'm done here. Please, everyone, stop engaging me. This is too insulting to endure. Just stop.

                "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                by ZhenRen on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 04:31:51 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  yes, NOW you want people to stop talking to you. (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  scrivener76

                  on a blog that you made sure to post your story and opinion on the second post over an hour after the diary went live.   because commenting below others might not have gotten enough attention?   and people didn't take your story more seriously than they took their em>own?  and so you called them all sorts of insulting names all over this diary?   and now you want people to stop talking to you?  

                   i'm glad you showed yourself here today.  it's the exact same person i thought you were.  transparency is good.

                  i don't abide whiners and i'm immune to your namecalling (see below).   hiderate me.   i. don't. care.  

                  "From single strands of light we build our webs." ~kj

                  by kj in missouri on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 05:10:34 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Heh (0+ / 0-)

                    Looks like the self-described "defiant one" who prides himself in defying the powers that be (lol) can't stand any real defiance. Sorry to break it to you, but supporting everything the Dems serve up isn't defiance. Or did I misunderstand? Maybe you meant you're defiant to the real left, an assertion which would make much more sense. You sit in the centrist, tepid, do-nothing middle, and defy those who protest the status quo, which you epitomize.

                    I did call some here a well deserved name, in calling them classist.

                    I really do think many here are expressing subconscious classism, which affects even the poor, in that sometimes even the oppressed and poor think they deserve to be in poverty, having bought into the capitalist notions of social Darwinism.

                    And I'm seeking attention? Heh. I knew when I posted that a gaggle of sycophants would object to my comment.

                    And your latest remark is yet another attack from the one who called me "whiner" and "dick", and then has the audacity to accuse me of name calling when I respond, as if you're privileged to do what I am not allowed. So typical of you status quo types.

                    You must be conscious of your hypocrisy, since it's so blatant, but I guess that's a state of being in which you don't mind living.

                    And yeah, I knew from earlier interactions with you that you.don't care. So, what else is new?

                    "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                    by ZhenRen on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 06:21:22 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  ...entitled to your own opinion not your own facts (0+ / 0-)

                      etc.  timestamps are your friend, ZhenRen, as to you and your namecalling.   many here can read and follow sequence and can see that you typed more than "classist."   que sara.  i don't care what you say about me, i do care what you've said to others, because this diary isn't about you, no matter how many times you've attempted to make it all about you.

                      you, ZhenRen, know exactly nothing about me, my life, my politics, or even my gender.  again, that's why i don't care what you say.  it's made-up fiction.  it's school-yard taunts.  it means nothing.

                      i am sorry you can't find a way to find $327 to carry catastrophic medical at the very least.  you are not the only one in that situation.  but this is not a socialist country other than worshipping at the feet of Bernie Sanders, and i do, nothing i say here today to the people who are benefiting from ACA can change that.  some of us are happy and relieved.  some of us feel some hope.

                      let people celebrate for one day, okay?  

                      "From single strands of light we build our webs." ~kj

                      by kj in missouri on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 07:07:44 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  My god... (0+ / 0-)

                        If you've got time and inclination to look at time stamps, to figure out the inanity of "you called me names first!" then you have my enduring sympathies.

                        It's your pathetic notion of having some sort of status to call me names, while criticizing me for name calling, that I was referencing.

                        You're a bully, and there are times I won't lie down and let people like you insult with impunity without saying a word in return. I will stand up to smug, self-righteous jerks. Count on it.

                        I came here and made a comment, and you've been on my ass with insulting ankle biting ever since (which you've graced me with on several other occasions, so its clearly personal with you).

                        And no, this isn't a socialist country. What a crass understatement. In fact, it is a cruel, murderous, imperialist, semi-fascist (for lack of a better term) country that treats the nations of the world as if they are all client states, here to bend to its will and power. And it excells at exploiting its own citizenry, extracting their wealth for the benefit of a few. Living here has awakened me to the need for socialism, much to the annoyance of capitalists on sites like this, but so be it. You act as if the cold war is still on, and you still don't realize there are other socialist choices besides Stalinism. You raise the fact that I'm a socialist as if it's an insult that makes my perspective automatically suspect. Yes, it shows... you're a diehard capitalist true believer. Pathetic. You actually seem to think that throwing my socialism in my face is an insult... and that speaks volumes about your mindset.

                        And your repeated strawman that "this diary isn't about you" is, well, a logical fallacy that you keep resurrecting as if it has more significance than a transparently empty ploy to invalidate using any distraction you can throw in my path.

                        But frankly, while this diary isn't about me, the issue I raise is certainly about anyone who isn't getting the healthcare he or she needs, and it counters the supporters who propagandize the ACA as "affordable" or "universal health care" which it clearly is not. And stories like mine need to be told and given the respect and place they deserve. People not getting appropriate health care deserve respect, deserve to be heard, and not treated as if enemies of the democratic party establishment.

                        I'm not at my best at the moment, because I'm with a head cold, and my head feels as if I'm underwater, but I will not refrain from responding to this kind of treatment.

                        And stop repeatedly telling me you're oh so "sorry" for my situation. We both know that's bullshit, and insulting.  And it's "que será" not "sara."

                        "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                        by ZhenRen on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 08:06:10 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  i'm a socialist (0+ / 0-)

                          so you see why i don't take what you say about me with any seriousness.

                          good night, ZhenRen.  hopefully we won't meet again anytime soon.  i have no desire to play strawman to your victimhood again.

                          "From single strands of light we build our webs." ~kj

                          by kj in missouri on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 08:16:40 PM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

                          •  I have a hard time believing (0+ / 0-)

                            you have any real idea what socialism is.

                            No aware, class conscious socialist would say a person experiencing problems getting health care is indulging in "victimhood". You're using capitalist terminology to insult. This is what I meant about subconscious classism.

                            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                            by ZhenRen on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 08:28:16 PM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  your. own. words. (0+ / 0-)
                            Actually (0+ / 0-)
                            There are victims here. We're victims of the hegemony of the wealthy class. That we aren't victims of this economic inequality is the myth they want us to believe.

                            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                            by ZhenRen on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 07:29:20 PM CDT

                            you have defined yourself well, ZhenRen.

                            "From single strands of light we build our webs." ~kj

                            by kj in missouri on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 06:30:26 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Exactly true (0+ / 0-)

                            Socialists do see the working class as victims of the owner class. My point is exactly the opposite of what you think. Your view is obviously that people without health care should not act as if victims, which is a capitalist point of view that people are the cause of their own poverty.

                            We all are victims of capitalism. That's the socialist view.

                            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                            by ZhenRen on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 09:01:10 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  In other words... (0+ / 0-)

                            it isn't an indulgence into "victimhood" as if unwarranted, but rather it is a fact that people are victims of capitlaism. Victimhood, the way you use the phrase, treats people as if they are manufacturing their claim without cause. Thus, you referred to my comments as if "whining" which is a decidedly pro-capitalist view that people should not complain of their poverty and need, as if these problems are entirely self-caused.

                            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                            by ZhenRen on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 09:06:18 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  i am never going to be okay (0+ / 0-)

                            with the use of the word "victim" for reasons that are far too long and complex to go into on a blog.  i reject the word and i reject the whiney selfish dickish behavior when i see it. as i did here in your response to another family:

                            Well, I can't speak for anyone other than our (4+ / 0-)
                            family.

                            ACA has meant better insurance for us, with rebates both of the last two years. And we no longer have to worry about switching insurers and getting caught in that pre-existing condition trap if one of us gets sick after switching. Hooray! It's free market competition for us now.

                            by elmo on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 05:25:27 PM CDT

                             You got yours, good for you (0+ / 0-)
                            Typical American attitude. Unless the flood waters are lapping at your doorstep, you can smile at the problems others endure and tell them to be "positive".

                            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                            by ZhenRen on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 06:39:59 PM CDT

                            i also don't know any socialist's who have ever had a sailboat, so you can take your lessons in gobblygook to someone who might think you're worth listening to.  i don't.

                            last word is yours.   call me as many names as you'd like.  

                            "From single strands of light we build our webs." ~kj

                            by kj in missouri on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 09:34:58 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  I bought an old boat fixer boat about 20 years ago (0+ / 0-)

                            to sail around for awhile. A lot of people who don't have loads of money do this. Sue me.

                            Socialism doesn't mean one must live in austere poverty. Quite the contrary. So you've let loose yet another clue about your lack of knowledge about socialism. Socialist communities can enjoy life and people can have hobbies and interests. Socialism isn't the austere form  it took in the USSR. There are other forms of egalitarian, socialist, community self-management than the Marxist-Leninist variety.

                            And most socialists I know have the view that the 1%, the capitalist elites, use their gridlock on property and wealth to enslave the working class to a life of servitude to the owning class.

                            That makes them victims. You really don't seem to have any real base of knowledge about socialism.

                            And yes, I think the "I got mine" attitude is a hallmark of American capitalist culture.

                            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                            by ZhenRen on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 10:12:20 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  Edit: "old fixer boat" -nt (0+ / 0-)

                            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

                            by ZhenRen on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 10:13:23 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

        •  The exchanges are certainly not for everyone. (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Willa Rogers, coppercelt, GleninCA

          My enthusiasm for the Kentucky marketplace and the lowered premiums I will pay have certainly blinded me to the fact that there are those who work and still need free health care.  I hope you and your partner are able to get a waiver and I share your wish of universal health care.

          "This isn't for the ones who would gladly swallow everything their leaders would have them know". Mary Chapin Carpenter

          by malenda on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 01:46:56 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  I saw a bagger on the being liberal FB page (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kyril

      and he was saying that he was getting the info and prices and then going to tell his fellow americans how evil it is SMH.

    •  wow! (5+ / 0-)

      only $327 a month plus out-of-pocket $4,000 deductible?

      we faced $1,800+ a month plus $5,000 each out-of-pocket deductible each.  we did without, for the second time in our adult lives.  such fun to let on-going physical issues (that require surgery) stew for years and years.   hell, for a chance at only $327 a month i would have worked a night shift at MacDonald's.

      it's all relative, man.

      "From single strands of light we build our webs." ~kj

      by kj in missouri on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 01:24:41 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  That's only $80 or more than (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        kj in missouri, mkoz

        I pay for my employer-subsidized 80/20 plan. I get not having another $300+/month to pay out, and I don't think the ACA is that good, but the alternative would be worse, unless you don't put a high price on health.

        "Lone catch of the moon, the roots of the sigh of an idea there will be the outcome may be why?"--from a spam diary entitled "The Vast World."

        by bryduck on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 02:09:32 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  We work 4 jobs between us (0+ / 0-)

        I like your attitude:

        Shorter version:

        Get another job, you deadbeat!
        Social Darwinism at its finest. Is that you, Mr. Trump?

        For some individuals, adding $327 (900 without tax credits) to one's expenses is enough to make life not worth living, in an already miserable situation.

        Goddamn all insensitive capitalists. Just goddamn them.

        And let's keep all little Oliver Twists away from your greedy, 1% enabling hands.

        "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

        by ZhenRen on Tue Oct 01, 2013 at 02:18:26 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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