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  •  Tell me I have a better choice (30+ / 0-)

    The last time a Democrat held this district was 1979... the Republican that won it was Newt Gingrich.  In the 2012 election, Tom Price won the general election with 64.51% of the vote, beating out his opponent by almost 30 points.

    I'd certainly volunteer for and donate my time and money to the democrat contender in the general but I'll donate to any candidate that will unseat Tom Price in the primary. If he won't do his job and I can't get him replaced with a democrat who better represents my views, the only option left to me is to support any candidate no matter what their party that will remove him from office.

    •  I'm inclined to do the same here. (15+ / 0-)

      My "Representative" is Cynthia Lummis (R-Teabagistan) and I will gladly support anyone who is more sane than she.

      Also I have to put up with Liz Cheney running for Senate, which means I may have to support Mike Enzi as he is at least more sane than Lizzie (which unfortunately isn't saying much).

      •  have fun at republican HQ (4+ / 0-)

        "...i also also want a legally binding apology." -George Rockwell

        by thankgodforairamerica on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 09:21:41 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I always voted for the republican.... (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          tharu1, Mayfly, FarWestGirl

          the democrat has the best chance to beat.

          You shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you mad. Aldous Huxley

          by murrayewv on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 12:19:03 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  they're not talking about voting in an R primary (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            tharu1, Odysseus, cspivey

            If that were all, fine.

            They're talking about building the republican party. They just don't understand that's what they're offering to do.

            I think if they'd ever worked on a campaign, they might get it.

            "...i also also want a legally binding apology." -George Rockwell

            by thankgodforairamerica on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 12:38:32 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I'd love to *rebuild* the republican party (12+ / 0-)

              I'd love to see the republican party that gave us Herbert Hoover saying "a chicken in every pot and a car in every garage". How's that for populist?  I'd love to see the republican party that gave us Eisenhower (ended McCarthyism, expanded Social Security, and started the national highway system among other things).  I won't say they or their party was perfect, but then I don't think I could say that about the democratic party either in all honesty.

              But for the country to have an effective dialogue where we discuss two or more views on an issue without immediately referring to the other side as the enemy or calling them a traitor, we either need to see the republican party rebuilt or dismantled completely with a new progressive party being created on the left.  That dialogue though is essential to a functioning democracy and it has to be one where at the end of the day, we're all still real Americans despite our differences.

              And being honest with myself, conservatism isn't all bad and it isn't even always wrong.  Fiscal conservatism can be a good thing as long as it doesn't go so far down the path that it ends up in austerity. Deregulation is needed especially when those regulations thoughtlessly inhibit growth (look at software patents for a great example of an area in need of deregulation).  Social policies that are being abused need reform so they can do the job they were intended to do effectively.  And yes, not every social problem can be fixed by throwing money at it.

              I don't think I'd ever be "at home" as a conservative... I'm too much of a progressive at heart. I just don't think that conservatism is another word for evil either.  If we got a republican party that more closely resembles the conservative parties of Europe we'd end up with a democratic party that was able to be a real progressive party... and I don't think many people here would find that a bad thing.

              But I've digressed considerably from my original statement... and that is simply that I'd love to give "safe" republicans more to fear in being primaried from the left than they currently have to fear in being primaried by the tea party right.

              •  With the Cold War over... (0+ / 0-)

                ...I doubt there's much chance of our ruling class uniting in a "moderate center" consensus on policy and budget priorities like the post-WWII Republicans and Democrats were able to maintain.

                That's been plenty OK with me for a couple- or three decades, now, but I admit that I'm having second thoughts these days.

                •  Both Clinton and Obama, both in philosophy (3+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  AdamSchmidt, wonmug, slothlax

                  and leadership tendencies are way to the extreme right of anything Eisenhower did. In fact, they are more along the lines of Barry Goldwater who, at one point, expressed deep concern for the religious zealot influence on the party at the time and had no trouble with gays serving in the military.

                  Additionally Eisenhower approached leadership from an entirely different perspective that is almost out of reach today: part of his preparation for the office of President was having to see the direct results of sending men into primitive combat situations and watching the coffins leave London bound for the United States - tens of thousands of them. He also got to experience first-hand the effects of managing operations involving vast amounts of materials as well as scheduling, replenishment of vital supplies and delegating authority to people best qualified to handle mission-critical tasks. With that kind of practical experience, nobody who has since held the office of President (or aspired to hold it) would, as my departed father used to say, make a respectable pimple on Eisenhower's ass.

                  •  Yes & no. (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    AdamSchmidt, slothlax

                    I do think that both Clinton and Obama would have been comfortable in Eisenhower's Republican Party.  Neither is "extreme right" of that, and I really don't think either of 'em have much in common with Barry Goldwater.  But then, neither does your average Tea Partier.  They're more in the mold of George Wallace.

                    •  Clinton willingly bought into Reaganomics (3+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      wonmug, codairem, slothlax

                      and the cult of Anh Rand by signing the commodities and futures modernization act into law; something Eisenhower would have never stood for, given his clearly documented suspicions about Industry's tendancy to dominate military supply manufacturing at the expense of domestic spending.

                      And after the outcome of the Korean War, it's incomprehensible that Eisenhower would have perpetuated an unfunded, undeclared war as Obama has.

                      Right-wing behavior always exposes right-wing philosophy. Situational morality notwithstanding, I respectfully disagree.

                      •  There are two Presidents I truly admire... (3+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        Calamity Jean, slothlax, blueoasis

                        Eisenhower and Teddy Roosevelt.  There are a few more that come close but those two top my list. They were both Republicans and yet neither one would be welcome in today's Republican party.  Frankly, they'd both probably be considered too progressive for today's Democratic party. I don't claim either one was perfect but they were damn impressive.

                •  the republican MO, (3+ / 0-)

                  for the last 25 years or so, has traditionally been about creating enemies rather than building coalitions.

                  hope springs eternal and DAMN is she getting tired!

                  by alguien on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 05:22:41 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

              •  Rebuilding Hoovervilles? (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Anakai, terabytes
                I'd love to see the republican party that gave us Herbert Hoover saying "a chicken in every pot and a car in every garage".
                True.  But then, as now, the end result of their policies is "Two families in every garage."
      •  Help! I fell overboard, I'm surrounded by (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        sharks and I'm drowning!

        Forget the life preserver and toss me that bar bell over there...

        •  exactly (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Anakai, mahakali overdrive

          I can't believe kossacks are rec'ing this and not HRing it.

          And it was rescued. That just adds insult to injury.

          "...i also also want a legally binding apology." -George Rockwell

          by thankgodforairamerica on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 01:55:00 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  I'll take the snark... (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          AdamSelene, dinazina

          Just so you understand, I've never voted Republican in my life. I find both the Log Cabin Republicans and GOProud absolutely mystifying and often disgusting. I think the tea party as it stands is the single most destructive force in American politics.  I can't go onto republican blogs for too long without feeling ill at the blatant racism and hatred that I see expressed there.  

          All that being said... I can do one of the following:

          1 - Move. Believe me I've considered it many times but that's just giving up and letting them win.

          2 - Work for democrats in other districts and states who have a chance of winning. If that's all I'm doing, why not just go ahead and move?

          3 - Work for and donate to democrats in my district (if any bother to run) and watch them lose by 40 points because the people here are so used to voting for whoever has the "R" by their name.  And no, I'm not kidding about that 40 point spread, that's about the usual.

          4 - Find a way to get "better" republicans.  Even if its only a republican who at least knows that if they go too far like say shutting down the government they were elected to serve in, that they'll soon find their ass on the way out the door.

          5 - Give up and hide my head in the sand waiting for things to get better on the national level and someday dragging this conservative enclave along with it.

          I've tried going with route 3 for 25 years and it hasn't worked.  That's why I'm looking at #4 and going for better republicans if I can't get a democrat elected here.  I just don't know if you can really understand what it's like here... this is the county (Cobb) that led the U.S. in putting stickers on their science textbooks explaining that the contents were just theory and not fact.  Georgia has been neck and neck with Texas in "revising" their history textbooks.

          Even if by some miracle a democrat was elected here, they wouldn't look anything like what you think a democrat would look like. They'd likely be in favor of prayer in schools (I'm unfortunately serious here).

          •  Understand? You bet I understand.... (4+ / 0-)

            Being a "victim"- of sorts -  of a family whose father was engaged in the defense industry and his career path having produced multiple relocations, my teenage years were spent in southern Virginia in the middle and late 60s where the Klan was still occasionally lynching black men for even looking at white women, and the local cops just turned their heads. Although I'm not black I know exactly what kind of environment you're dealing with.

            I opted for your #1. Had I spent any longer in that place, I would have died both mentally and physically. Once I left behind the magnolias, greasy barbecue, deep-fried lard-sickles and phony religious zealots, I flourished. My creativity blossomed... I took my studies seriously again because I could concentrate on them in an environment that wasn't tainted with cronyism, religious hypocrisy and being force-fed "values" that had no value to me.

            Taking your talents and skills elsewhere to a place where you can once again grow the courage of your convictions, use critical thinking without being threatened with fundie BS and better yourself does far more damage to those people than trying to swim in their cesspool. When you remove just one source of economic support (the local taxes you pay) and one more talent or skill that they can no longer exploit (your job), you've done about as much to them as any one person can do--- short of hitting Powerball and buying yourself an election like the rest of them.

            Good luck to you, friend. You are in an unenviable position. My best wishes to you and your loved ones - and may you resolve this dilemma to your satisfaction and future well-being.

            •  Well said! (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Anakai, PsychoSavannah

              I too live in a deeply red enclave, MO-7. They call us the buckle of the bible belt. I know exactly how it feels to wonder at times if there is something wrong with me because of the way I think, or choose to live my life, is so much more different than people around me think or live their lives.

              I've been here now going on ten years and almost everyday is a struggle. I started my career and my family here. Almost everyday at look a job boards in other places daydreaming of one day moving there. Even though I really love my job, I would take a comparable position elsewhere just to get away from here.

              I make the most of it. I've found a small group of like minded people who help keep each other sane. We focus our efforts on local elected positions where sometimes our numbers may be enough to vote in one sane person to the city council, school board, or a state representative.

              Yeah, voting out our House Representative is virtually impossible, but we take our little victories where we can get them.

            •  Run away! (0+ / 1-)
              Recommended by:
              Hidden by:

              That's the answer. Just like the middle class white people who decry urban schools as they run away to the suburbs. You are all a bunch of cowards who took the easy way out, but at the root of it you are the problem. The diarist is completely right, stand and fight is the only way to win.

              There is truth on all sides. The question is how much.

              by slothlax on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 09:33:35 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  How well did "Rope A Dope" work... (0+ / 0-)

                ...for Mohammed Ali? Not so much. All he has left now is the admiration of his fans - that's it. It's tragic, it's sad... But it was also his choice. The same can be said for Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, Florida, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana, Texas, Oklahoma, Ohio, Kentucky, Tennessee, etc.
                Everyone has free agency to live wherever they want using their own best judgement. That applies to you as well... But rather than poison my mind and those of my kids, I chose to opt out of perpetuating "stupid" by living somewhere that is physically and spiritually dangerous for me, my wife and the rest of my family. If that makes me a "coward", "taking the easy way out" and the root part of your problem, then I'm very happy that I'm here where I'm at and you are wherever you are.

                •  If you aren't willing to stand and fight (0+ / 0-)

                  then you have absolutely no reason to complain about why districts continue to elect people like Alan West, Michelle Bachmann, Rand Paul, and so on.

                  •  I don't complain about them - I mock them. (0+ / 0-)

                    And I do everything within my lawful civic duty to ensure two things:

                    1. That right wing trash with intellectual syphilis never gets elected to any position of authority in my locality;

                    2. Do my part - in forums such as this and in other ways and places - to help usher in the day when regressive politicians, their fixers and tortured logic become irrelevant to the future of this country.

                    I don't pretend to imagine that I can affect or effect the thought processes in other places like Minnesota or South Carolina that causes people to elect people to positions of authority who are criminally insane. I am, however, free to express my views on them, as are you.

                •  I live in the "ghetto" (0+ / 0-)

                  That's what people from the suburbs say when they come to my house. I live here because I know, even though I'm in the minority, I make a difference by living here

                  There is truth on all sides. The question is how much.

                  by slothlax on Sat Oct 05, 2013 at 11:58:17 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

    •  i'm coming over to check your cellar for pods (0+ / 0-)

      Didn't you write a diary a few years back about electing more and better democrats? That's very different from electing the same number of, but less worse, republicans.

      "...i also also want a legally binding apology." -George Rockwell

      by thankgodforairamerica on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 08:09:44 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Not mutually exclusive (17+ / 0-)

        In a hopelessly red district, support the most moderate Republican in the primary and the Democrat in the general.

        Disclaimer: If the above comment can possibly be construed as snark, it probably is.

        by grubber on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 08:26:55 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Yeah I did and I still mean it (13+ / 0-)

        But how else can I make a difference?  Seriously. I mean it. The district I live in gave us all Newt frick'n Gingrich. Now it's given us Tom Price who makes Newt look like a flaming liberal by comparison.

        I look forward to electing another democrat for president in 2016 and it's possible that Georgia might even go blue in that election (we might even elect a democrat as Senator in 2014) but the chances of this district electing a democrat to the house is minuscule.  So if I can't get a democrat elected to the House from my district no matter how hard I try, then at least I have to do what I can to make sure that whatever republican is elected from this district at least does their job.  And knows that if they refuse to do their job, then they'll be replaced in their primary election.

        But I am dead serious... if you have another suggestion I'll be thrilled to hear it.  Please tell me how I can make a difference in a district where Tom Price (R-Nutjob) won his seat with 189,000 votes to his opponent's 104,000.

        •  you want to make a difference? (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          Then you don't brag about how you're going to work for the enemy.

          You toughen up. You be an example. You build your party, so when you have a candidate, you're ready. You sure as hell don't do what you're boasting about doing.

          "...i also also want a legally binding apology." -George Rockwell

          by thankgodforairamerica on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 08:57:27 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  You're definitely missing my point. (20+ / 0-)

            It's not that I'm going rah rah for a republican. It is that I'm letting my representative know that if they insist on this shutdown that whether or not I can help to get them replaced with a democrat, I'll damn sure do my best to make sure they don't even make it through the primary.  That I'll make an effort just to get them voted out of office for abandoning their duty to their constituents.

            On a side note, they aren't the enemy. They're Americans just like you are, just like I am.  And we're better Americans when we have a dialogue among people with differing opinions and thoughts so that we can come to real compromise for the betterment of all.  For that to happen, we need the republican party to regain their sanity.  That or we need to be prepared to build from scratch a new progressive party to go up against the democrats when the republicans devolve into a minority regional party.  Either way, the dialogue is important and it needs to be one where we see each other as fellow citizens... not the enemy.

            •  so how is this going to play out? (0+ / 0-)
              It's not that I'm going rah rah for a republican.
              when you're at your republican candidate's HQ, you're going to unenthusiastically volunteer? maybe you'll go meh meh?

              and about this:

              On a side note, they aren't the enemy. They're Americans just like you are, just like I am.  And we're better Americans when we have a dialogue among people with differing opinions and thoughts so that we can come to real compromise for the betterment of all.
              which "they" are we talking about? some of "them" are people I enjoy talking to, and count as friends. for real. some of "them" are sociopaths and malignant narcissists who are hell bent on destroying us.

              "...i also also want a legally binding apology." -George Rockwell

              by thankgodforairamerica on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 11:21:42 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

        •  Help drive that split in the Rethug Party (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Calamity Jean, PsychoSavannah

          I get it, the criticism that working in a campaign is actually, tangibly, helping "build" the Republican Party in your district.  But, in a primary election context, in a Teahadist's district, finding Rockefeller Republicans join with to contest the Tea Party Christianists that seem to have a grip on the Party now is a good way to help your local Republicans along the road to a debilitating split.  And, that's always good for America.

      •  Not different at all (0+ / 0-)

        In fact its the exact same thing, moving the needle to the left. If you don't understand that you need to bone up a little bit more on politics.

        There is truth on all sides. The question is how much.

        by slothlax on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 09:42:51 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  You can help Democrats anywhere (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      annominous, thomlch, Lujane

      You won't take Price out, but there are going to be races (mostly out of state) where the Republican is vulnerable.  The Democrats in that race can use your money and even your time.

      The best way to get at Price is to put him into the minority.  I get that in places like yours, people register Republican to just have a say.  But right now, if the alternative votes for a GOP speaker, he or she will be no better.

      Quote of the week: "They call themselves bipartisan because they're able to buy members of both parties," (R. Eskow, Campaign for America's Future.)

      by mbayrob on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 12:25:11 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  I can tell you're from the south (5+ / 0-)

      ..... you used Democrat rather than the adjective, Democratic. :-/

      This time, the elephant must go down. And if possible, it must be so wounded it does not get up for a long time to come. -- Andrew Sullivan, 1 October 2013

      by billlaurelMD on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 12:50:56 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  ayup... ;-) (5+ / 0-)

        Born in Los Angeles to republican Catholics, grew up in Knoxville, lived in Atlanta for the last 25 years.  And here I am a gay, atheist, democrat.  And I'm so used to hearing "democrat" I have a hard time any more with the correct usage of democrat vs. democratic.  All I can ask is that even if I don't get the words right every time, please try to understand the heart from which they come.

    •  When you say "any" (0+ / 0-)

      I hope you mean someone like an actual, non-insane conservative, not another even-more-batshit teabagger? Because otherwise, it just sounds like a personal vendetta rather than an attempt to push things in the right direction.

      "All governments lie, but disaster lies in wait for countries whose officials smoke the same hashish they give out." --I.F. Stone

      by Alice in Florida on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 01:39:36 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Living in red, red, red South Carolina (7+ / 0-)

        with Joe "You Lie!" Wilson as my rep, I understand where AdamSchmidt is coming from.  People in blue or even purple districts don't get the frustration and despair.....but one of the ways we can undermine the teabaggers is to work for more sane republicans where necessary.  In some of these districts a democrat doesn't even run!  It's a waste of time and money and they know it.  

        So, people may give him shit for it, but if he can help remove the nutbar teabagger from the definitely-gonna-be-republican district, then more power to him.  We have to get those extremists out of our government.  

        Listening to the NRA on school safety is like listening to the tobacco companies on cigarette safety. (h/t nightsweat)

        by PsychoSavannah on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 01:55:23 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  i bet markos LOVES the idea (0+ / 0-)

          "...i also also want a legally binding apology." -George Rockwell

          by thankgodforairamerica on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 02:01:46 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Do I give a flying fuck what Markos (6+ / 0-)

            thinks?  This is not something that needs to happen all over the country and it will not work in every single district.  But the idea should not automatically be discarded and ridiculed.

            I will never, ever, in a million lifetimes get a truly left-leaning democrat in my district.  That's America.  And we all do what we can to make where we live the best we can.  Adam's district, and the country, WILL benefit from a non-teabagging, less radical republican in it since it's going to have a republican representing it....that is fait accompli.

            Listening to the NRA on school safety is like listening to the tobacco companies on cigarette safety. (h/t nightsweat)

            by PsychoSavannah on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 02:11:21 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  I absolutely understand (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          I am talking about what we call here locally a "Jack Latvala Republican," referring to a state senator who pushed back against many of Gov. Scott's most egregious initiatives. I just made that comment because the commenter seemed to be saying he'd support any opponent in the R primary, when often in deep red districts the insurgent candidate is to the right of the incumbent.

          "All governments lie, but disaster lies in wait for countries whose officials smoke the same hashish they give out." --I.F. Stone

          by Alice in Florida on Thu Oct 03, 2013 at 08:58:16 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  I am supporting a Republican in a State Senate (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      AdamSchmidt, PsychoSavannah, slothlax

      race.  I have a choice between two wing-nuts, based on what they have said.  One is part of a Christian Identity group, which he refuses to talk about, and is being funded by his church.  The other is a normal wing-nut.  I'm supporting the normal wing nut.  All indications this Christian Identity church is trying to get as many of their folks into office as they can.  I won't stand idly by when an anti-Semitic, anti-women,  etc, group tries to sneak their way into power.

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