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View Diary: Republican shutdown is not playing well in Peoria. Or Kansas City. Or Sacramento. Or ... (171 comments)

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  •  Quick (possibly stupid) Question (6+ / 0-)

    Is the GOP trying to pass a budget that does not pay for ACA - in other words are they refusing to vote for a budget because it contains $ for the ACA.

    OR

    Are they refusing to raise the debt limit because UNLESS the ACA is compromised in some way.

    I've got an idiot telling me that this is no different than any time a congressional house refuses to provide money for a law (which does happen, I seem to remember).  But I suspect that that is not what's going on here.  Is this a budget stand-off or a debt limit stand off?  Has a budget been passed?

    Just pointing me to an article that explains what's up would be great.

    •  The ACA is mandatory spending (13+ / 0-)

      so the government shutdown doesn't actually affect its roll out. They are holding the rest of the government funding hostage looking for concessions on it's implementation. What their demands will be in order to raise the debt ceiling remain to be seen but they plan on holding that hostage too. They can't actually stop the ACA but what they're doing does impact the rest of the government and the threat to the economy is very very real.

      It's not a budget they're passing. It's a continuing resolution at sequester level spending that will only fund the government for 6 weeks as it is. This fight will happen again. The Senate has passed a budget & the House has passed a budget but Republicans have refused 17 times to appoint a conference committee. The committee they've now appointed is for the CR.

      Here's a good piece on the situation John Boehner’s Shutdown

      "Compassion is the radicalism of our time." ~ Tenzin Gyatso, 14th Dalai Lama -7.88, -6.21

      by Siri on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 09:57:26 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Not quite (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      JBL55
      Is the GOP trying to pass a budget that does not pay for ACA - in other words are they refusing to vote for a budget because it contains $ for the ACA.
      The continuing resolution that the House passed did not include funding for the Affordable Care Act. They think that, if they simply do not provide money for the act, that law will have been defeated in this manner. The continuing resolution that the Senate approved and sent back to the House stripped the ACA language, and was simply a so-called clean resolution to continue funding government services at current levels.
      Are they refusing to raise the debt limit because UNLESS the ACA is compromised in some way.
      The current shutdown has nothing to do with the debt limit. That matter will come to a vote at some time in the next few weeks when the debt limit must be raised in order to pay the bills for things that have already been approved by both houses and signed into law by the president.

      Habit of eating have been found increased in people, they just need a sitting place where they can finish their hunger. -- spammer pauldavis 8/21/13

      by Senor Unoball on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 10:02:45 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Well then- (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Senor Unoball, mikejay611

        How is this different from when Congress has not provided funds for other laws?  I think that's happened before (although I can't think of any examples...).

        Because this idiot I'm talking too seems a lot less idiotic if this is just congress not passing funding for a law it doesn't like.  What they're doing is still horrible, but it's harder to argue with someone who says "Congress can refuse to finance a standing law it doesn't like.  There's plenty of precedent."

        And what does Mandatory Spending have to do with the congressional budget, then?  What makes it mandatory if it's in a budget that may or may not get passed?

        •  Well then.... (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          MKinTN, mikejay611

          There are things that some state officials call "unfunded mandates." That is, Congress passes a law that states have to follow, but then the states have to come up with the funding.

          Off top of my head, however, I cannot think of things that have been signed into federal law that Congress does not provide funding for. I'd be happy for someone to come up with some examples.

          That is what the whole budgetary process is about. The House decides the level of funding needed for certain programs: How much to give to the military, how much to give to Department of Agriculture, how much to give to this and to that.

          They can, and certainly have, for example, told the military services that they will not fund a particular weapons program.

          But that's not what is going on in this particular situation. Right now, the two houses are not in a conference committee trying to reconcile two different budgets.

          This is a continuing resolution that is being offered because there is no proposed budget being discussed. All that is on the table (or off the table, I guess), is a resolution to keep funding the government for a few more months until an honest-to-god budget is approved by both sides and signed by the president.

          (And which would be topic of a diary of its own.)

          Repubs in the House have said that they will only fund the government if ACA funding is stripped.

          Dems in the Senate have said they will not agree with that. They have offered their own resolution to keep things going as is, but the House has said they will not go along with that.

          Which has led to the current situation.

          If the person you've been talking to says that there is plenty of precedent for the current situation, ask them to provide those details.

          Habit of eating have been found increased in people, they just need a sitting place where they can finish their hunger. -- spammer pauldavis 8/21/13

          by Senor Unoball on Wed Oct 02, 2013 at 11:04:37 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  No -- they're NOT "passing a budget" (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Senor Unoball

            Both the Senate and the House passed THOSE this Spring, and then Boehner refused to call a conference committee to sort out the differences between the two budgets. That would have set the funding limits for the 13 appropriation bills which are what control the funding of government operations.

            So none of the appropriations bills have been passed. Now they're arguing over passing a "Continuing Resolution." A CR funds the government for a limited amount of time.

            The Dems want a clean CR -- the Republicans seem to think that by throwing a tantrum they can force the Dems to gut Obamacare. Not happening.

        •  This ISN'T about "funding a law" (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Senor Unoball

          It is about the House's failure to prepare and pass the 13 appropriation bills that fund the entire Federal government.

          They are holding government operations hostage in an attempt to sabotage the Affordable Care Act.

          By the way, there's no such thing as "funding a law."

          And the debt ceiling battle won't be starting for a couple of weeks.

    •  Not stupid. (7+ / 0-)

      Your question provided an opportunity for everyone reading this diary to nail down something they knew but couldn't fully explain if pressed.  Like me.  Thank you for asking it!

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